Above all, I would like to keep this civil, because I don't want the thread to be locked before a very large concensus can be made.
My view/opinion: The JBO has a horrible history of product reviews. It works like this; if someone has a positive review, there is generally no problem. However if someone has a negative review, a thread can go several ways. Please keep in mind I have never posted a product review, so these are unbiased observations of others' reviews:
1) People who have NO experience with the product post and bash the company and even personally insult the owner (against JBO forum rules if I am not mistaken). We all know what happens to a company with a bad rep, as this is mainly the case with companies that have a bad reputation on this board.
2) If the company has a decent rep, and the individual is against that concensus, the individual gets harassed for ragging on a "perfectly" good company.
3) All hell breaks loose and a 10 page bitchfest results.
My proposed solution: These posts have long polluted the most useful of forums on JBO : performance, boost and tuning for example. We need a product review forum where anyone can go, post a review (good, bad, or otherwise), and leave it at that. Smart cookies who research parts before buying will check out this forum and make a more informed decision. For example, if all the posts about RSM racing were gathered in one forum, I doubt ANYONE would deal with them (obvious one, just an example). Since there is no way to control the discrimination and flaming that I mentioned above, I think it would be better to segregate it from the technical forums. It will make research easier, and it will make it easier for the Moderators to control these threads when they get out of hand (i.e. break rules 5 and 6 of the forum rules).
So, what are your feelings on this?
I concur your Excellency.
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I concur your Excellency.
Hahaha. Well, I'm glad, but no one is sharing opinions/solutions here...
feelings....
the majority of people here will not do research to begin with. theres been many products sold on here by companies, and its basically stemmed from hearsay with their support.
no realistic claims backed by tested proof. some products sold are sold by comparing stock parts and the APPEARANCE of the new product.
it would be cool to see it cleaned up, but honestly, its been nearly 8 years of it straight... happens with new people each year. and honestly, if your head strong on getting it done.... by all means go for it. but with the amount of people here, dual accounts, and otherwise, its like trying to save the titanic from sinking with a single bucket or scooping out water....
Thanks for your opinions Event!!
We could change the future with the help of the Mods by creating a product review forum. With the J-Body platform now extinct, its even more important now to have useful, civilized product review discussions, OUTSIDE of the technical forums. Plus the Mods could screen posts that are overly insulting from people that don't even have the product.
Hahahaha, while im on a roll...the forum could be structured such that if you make an overly critical comment on a product that you have NO experience with (check the profiles), the thread could be LOCKED. That would keep everyone honest right?
i think something could be made closer to the rating system of say amazon, sort of.
i dont think the reviews should be open for discussion.
post your review on the product and leave it at that. make it so no one is allowed to reply to any topics. the only thing that can be done is new topics.
maybe even allow a response by the company to the persons review.
just dont allow full open discussion thats when all the idiots and wannabees come out talkign about the companies ins and outs liek they have dealt with them personally when in reality they have just READ about the company.
personally thats the only way i see this working. post product reviews that are not open to public discussion and leave them at that. then peopel can read the reviews and make up their own mind and do not have to browse through 25+ pages of bull@!#$.
Creative Draft Art Media Forums
The product bashing is one of the main reasons I do not goto any performance forums anymore, TBH.
That and 16-17 y/o's going on there and talking about things that they know nothing about. It drives me up a wall.
Team GREEN
Suspension Division - "Handling Before Horsepower"
Making the turns since 1999
1998 EK Civic Hatch - Yes, it's a Honda.
Nathaniel O'Flaherty wrote:i think something could be made closer to the rating system of say amazon, sort of.
i dont think the reviews should be open for discussion.
post your review on the product and leave it at that. make it so no one is allowed to reply to any topics. the only thing that can be done is new topics.
maybe even allow a response by the company to the persons review.
just dont allow full open discussion thats when all the idiots and wannabees come out talkign about the companies ins and outs liek they have dealt with them personally when in reality they have just READ about the company.
personally thats the only way i see this working. post product reviews that are not open to public discussion and leave them at that. then peopel can read the reviews and make up their own mind and do not have to browse through 25+ pages of bull@!#$.
I actually think this is mostly a good idea, except everyone with a review of the same product should be in one thread.
possibly make it a "hidden" forum where as the first thing that comes up when you search for something is any "review" thread of said product/ service, sort of like a search sticky, and the only way to add a review is through the contact us link..
that would keep the forums unclutered with reviews of products that people are not looking for and makie it easy/easier for those that are looking for said info.
IDK
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That and 16-17 y/o's going on there and talking about things that they know nothing about. It drives me up a wall.
I completely agree, that's why it would be nice to have reviews in a separate forum to maintain the value of the technical forums.
Setting up a performance review worth anything would require 2 things which the .Org hasn't got:
1. a test rig
2. a journalist that will not allow personal bias to taint resulting reports.
It's not likely to happen that people are going to offer up a stock car, dyno each time you change something, and set back to stock each time... Especially when you have resources like the GM Build book for the Ecotec engine (which is something that is fairly unique to GM if I'm not mistaken) where you can get upgrades just short of a full on turbo kit.
Really, I like the idea, but posting performance reviews by individuals is going to happen, and they're going to basically say whatever. The better idea is to eliminate the "seat of the pants" or eyeball dyno information, and go with actual test info (be it from a dynomometer/accelerometer, skid-pad, 1320, track day, etc..).
I find that if you challenge what someone says by asking for verifiable proof of improvement from original configuration, the comments will be pretty limited, and will generally trail off and what else turns up will be more usable.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
at LEAST if we make it so people arent leaving 300 comments that are ALSO bs it will be easier to see real reviews vs bad reviews.
allow reviews by normal people just dont allow the discussion and i think it will solve ALOT of the problems.
Creative Draft Art Media Forums
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at LEAST if we make it so people arent leaving 300 comments that are ALSO bs it will be easier to see real reviews vs bad reviews
Yea if you take all these kind of comments
out of the "go go go" forums, and furthermore take out all the questions that pop up like "what will this SPECIFIC part do for my car?", you actually have a very useful resource.
GAM, I like your idea of supplying "performance reviews", but all that I was hoping to spark interest in was a separate review forum, period. I bet one of maybe fifty reviews done here casually might have hard proof. There's just no structure at all right now, mainly just companies people like and ones they dislike...
I see...
If there were performance reviews done with any depth, you'd need to have a few things:
- Baseline (pre-installation information) for THAT PRODUCT. This basically will allow for build-ups etc. to happen and see cumulative gains
- Installation information, advertised gains, testing regimen information, recorded gains. (ie. objective/imperical data)
- Comments by the author for subjective data and maybe a thumbs up/thumbs down type final review (or a star system?).
- A separate section for user commentary/reviews.
I think doing something like this would require some basic stuff, like a Dynomometer (recent), a g-tech or some such accelerometer, a J-body (insert DUH! exclamation); not only this, but other things like a performance alignment done when talking about suspension or tire/wheel combinations or a recent detailled e-test and sound recordings before and after when dealing with cat-back or header installs.
Just my 2 cents, but I think it might be beyond the scope and interest of the J-body community, it's a starter car, and it's appeal in the tuning community is fairly limited.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
^^
But what about simply having reviews separate from technical posts? GAM, what you are describing would be awesome, but I can't think of any enthusiast site I've visited that does that, including honda and dsm sites. And like you said, its out of the scope of this site.
yea...boost would be nice...yea
I don't think that can be done with the current forum setup.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
at a bare minimum sub cats could be set up
add a new forum in the general section over on the left navigation.
[General Stuff ]
general
newbies
maintenance
PRODUCT REVIEWS
group purchase
then once you click on product reviews you have sub catagories of product reviews.
suspension product reviews
performance product reviews
cosmetic product reviews
etc...
this CAN be done because this is how off topic is set up. when u click off topic there are 2 sub catagories AG and AAG.
Creative Draft Art Media Forums
^^
That would be nice, but we could keep it simple and just have a product review forum separate from everything else, as a direction to point people to do research, as a place for companies to "plea their defenses" here, and finally to keep all the b/s out of the technical forums.
I'm not sure who is or who isn't a MOD but what do they say about it.... i personally like it.
03silverecocav (Gabe) wrote:I'm not sure who is or who isn't a MOD but what do they say about it.... i personally like it.
I'm not sure who has moderator priveledges either, but I know they're pretty good at reading everything posted on here.
