Scientology? OMG, another man-made religion. This is ridiculous!! There's enough confusion as there is and now we have this...
Evolution? I personally don't like it. People call it science, I call it crap! People might not want to accept it but Evolution is not science, it's a religion. A religion that's gone too far as to force itself upon everyone. You have more people believing we evolved from a fish, monkey, etc..more than we have people that believe in God. Why are we allowing this crap into our schools to corruption, pollute and destroy the minds of our children.
I do not believe they should be able to teach Evolution in schools. It promotes Athiest beliefs that there is no god.
Didn't atheist argue this about having "under god" in the pledge?
Josh
SLK 32
If you don't think evolution is science, you're simply not educated.
Even the Vatican supports evolution.
http://www.freemarketnews.com/Feedback.asp?nid=959
Quote:
It may not make the "creationist" crowd very happy, but their attacks on evolution might have to stop. According to an article from the Australian news.com website, the Vatican has issued a statement about the Darwinian theory of evolution and its relationship to Biblical scripture.
Cardinal Paul Poupard, head of the Pontifical Council for Culture, is quoted as saying the Genesis description of how God created the universe and Darwin's theory of evolution are "perfectly compatible" if the Bible is read correctly. It was a direct attack on the creationist campaigners in America.
"The fundamentalists want to give a scientific meaning to words that had no scientific aim," Poupard allegedly said at a Vatican press conference, declaring that the real message in Genesis was that "the universe didn't make itself and had a creator." His statements were interpreted in Italy as a rejection of the "intelligent design" view, which says the universe is so complex that some higher being must have designed every detail. - ST
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not allow evolution in schools??? That crazy...it's scientific fact.Just because someone believes in god doesn't mean we didn't evolve from something else.We should teach kids to think for themselves.That to me means teaching them the facts and the beliefs and let them decide.
I ain't callin u a gold digga,but you ain't messin wit a broke cracka
Actually Evolution is a theory, with some evidence supporting it.
That's the funny thing about science, we have a lot of theories but few laws/facts.
FireCav98 does have a good point tho, if you look at it from his point of view.
Evolution, Creationism, Scientology, "Intelligent Design"(meaning now confused for the populace due to stupid people)
are all religions.
Evolution is taught because Darwin wrote about specialization. Second Evolution isn't all it's cracked up to be. Darwins studies proved that specialization and variances in a population showed certain specialized traits to increase the chance of survival, thus those that were more fit for the environment lived on and those that weren't died. Evolution from Darwins studies was the genetic changes can make one particular genotype more likely to pass on it's genes thus proliferating that genetic trait.
However there is no hard proof for either case, and many contradictions to both beliefs, seeing as were grouping them into religion.
Personally I think they can all co-exist, as Agustin's quote from the Vatican.
The bible said god created the earth, the universe and everything, but left out a big detail of HOW!
If you want to be technicall schools should teach specialization, and its effects on survival of animals in small populations such as the galapagos islands (where much of Darwins research was conducted).
-Chris
AuGuSTiN: Educated I am. The Vatican supports it?! Are we speaking of the same Vatican that support the Pope who believe through Mary and other saints is the key to Heaven? I definately hope not. Evolution is a false doctrine which is and/or to become believe it or not a RELIGION. Pull the definition to Religion and see what you find:
Re-li-gion- n.
Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.
The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.
A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.
EcoFire: There's plenty of facts that's been presented to prove what the scriptures in the bible are true, but, the point I'm making is that they're going as far as teaching and including evolution into the schools cirriculum. Teaching our kids to think for themselves is one thing, but they're not being offered the scriptures of the bible so they can make a decision of their own. It's one sided. Wouldn't you say so?
My argument is if this crap is going to be allowed in schools, shouldn't there also be a class that teaches the scriptures of the bible?
I agree there, it is one sided. It is ok to teach about evolution and all the other theories BESIDE religion.
Josh
SLK 32
Well the question is, if they teach religion, which religion should they teach? That's something that would create more controversy than the evolution vs. religion debate...
Evolution is easy to teach beacuse it does not promote a religion. If you have bible study in highschool it'll favor Christianity...
You would easily teach about religion as a whole. Not individual.
Josh
SLK 32
And how would that work?
What would you teach about? What is religion as a whole...?
FireCav98 wrote:AuGuSTiN: Educated I am. The Vatican supports it?! Are we speaking of the same Vatican that support the Pope who believe through Mary and other saints is the key to Heaven? I definately hope not. Evolution is a false doctrine which is and/or to become believe it or not a RELIGION. Pull the definition to Religion and see what you find:
Re-li-gion- n.
Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.
The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.
A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.
Sorry, please explain this to me since I do not understand it. The Vatican supports both creationalism and evolution, is that a problem?
Why would evolution be considered a religion? Using the definition that you gave me, evolution contains no super power, it is not a religious order, and there's no spiritual leader. The only one that comes close is it is a cause that is pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion, but that statement is so vague that you could be talking about a Girls Gone Wild video or something.
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ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.
Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.
You would just have to teach it as a whole, the belief in believing in a supreme being and that there are "many options" out there.
I don't claim to have a specific answer.
The only thing holding that information from the classroom are the jackass athiest lawyers.
Josh
SLK 32
UpstateNyZ24 wrote:And how would that work?
What would you teach about? What is religion as a whole...?
I support this and wish they would teach it in high school even though I don't believe in any religions. Teach about the common themes in all religions, what religions teach us, how it can divide groups of people and start wars, etc
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ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.
Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.
Common themes in all religions? Like what? Respect, love...etc? Is that where you guys are going?
Quote:
how it can divide groups of people and start wars, etc
That's why they have history class in highschool.
FireCav98 wrote:AuGuSTiN: Educated I am. The Vatican supports it?! Are we speaking of the same Vatican that support the Pope who believe through Mary and other saints is the key to Heaven? I definately hope not.
I see I'm already winning the argument. As your best defense is attacking credibility and not merit. As if you're knowledge of the Bible is better than someone from the Vatican, period.
BTW, you spelled my name wrong.
FireCav98 wrote:
Evolution is a false doctrine which is and/or to become believe it or not a RELIGION. Pull the definition to Religion and see what you find:
Yeaaah...see nothing in there that makes evolution a religion. I don't know what you're spiritual leader is telling you, but evolution is scientific theory. There is no church of evolution.
For that matter, ask your preacher as to why the Book of Genesis has events of our order in the 6-days of Earth's construction. Such as light before sun, etc. That's your "fact", with holes!
FireCav98 wrote:
EcoFire: There's plenty of facts that's been presented to prove what the scriptures in the bible are true, but, the point I'm making is that they're going as far as teaching and including evolution into the schools cirriculum. Teaching our kids to think for themselves is one thing, but they're not being offered the scriptures of the bible so they can make a decision of their own. It's one sided. Wouldn't you say so?
Not being offered scriptures in our classrooms is the point of the consitution. I'm not sure what country you think you live in, but Freedom of Religion is why you even get to have a view on your interpretation of the Bible.
I'm sorry, but you're HIGHLY ill-informed. Dr. Agustin prescripes books, pounds and pounds of books!
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UpstateNyZ24 wrote:Common themes in all religions? Like what? Respect, love...etc? Is that where you guys are going?
Quote:
how it can divide groups of people and start wars, etc
That's why they have history class in highschool.
Like how all religions there's a higher power involved and what they represent, the use of symbolism and its meaning, each religions interpretation of an after-life (if any)....do I really have to explain this, you can't think of this on your own?
History classes dealt with political wars, not on religious wars.
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ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.
Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.
FireCav98 wrote: OMG, another man-made religion. .
Aren't all religions man-made? Hell... what ISN'T man-made anymore?
They're all @!#$ anyways. Get a grip.
Evolution as a theory is devoid of all taint of religion. Reading Darwin's Evolution of Species proves that.
Teaching Creationism in schools introduces a prejudicial element into your child's development. Yes, you can get as picky as the literal and allusionary aspects of the Bible (I don't remember if the Qur'ran has a "genesis" story in it..), the Torrah, Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (The cult where the people believe that creation was created in a big sneeze? Yeah.. that... ) and even Hinduism/Buddhism. I mean, if it's enough to split people on Religious lines, it's enough to cause a furor in the public school system. Look at it this way: Some people believe humans made God... Until we can prove/disprove it, we're operating in a large information defecit.
Theory of Evolution deals in the realm of facts that can be proven by observation and testing and postulations can be formed based on those observations and conclusions, whereas Creationism works the other way, and deals with very large leaps of faith.
The other thing that most people forget when squabbling (or bitching and moaning as the case may be) about these things is that Darwin was a devout Anglican... He didn't allow his ideals about the almighty pervade his work though.
Something to chew on.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
I completely believe in evolution. You're not getting the idea if you think we evolved from a fish to a monkey to us. Think of it like this, the theory is that species mutate to evolve. Can you die that mutations occur through DNA transcripting/translating etc. If you dont know anything about this, then maybe you should find out before you speak. Not from a fish to a monkey, but from a monkey to a better monkey. Charles Darwin witnessed his own theory. He was a scientist on a ship, he happened to also get sea sick, so they were usually close to land. While on his purging adventures he noticed species evolve. He saw some lizards at a particular island without webbed feet, and maybe notice one with webbed feet. When he came back a few years later to the same place, he noticed that all of the lizards he saw had webbed feet. Selecitve breeding is also another huge part of evolution. The male lizard that had webbed feet was more of a pimp daddy then the rest of the lizards, so all the chicks wanted to do him. You can use your imagination from there.
Rick wrote:I completely believe in evolution. You're not getting the idea if you think we evolved from a fish to a monkey to us. Think of it like this, the theory is that species mutate to evolve. Can you die that mutations occur through DNA transcripting/translating etc. If you dont know anything about this, then maybe you should find out before you speak. Not from a fish to a monkey, but from a monkey to a better monkey. Charles Darwin witnessed his own theory. He was a scientist on a ship, he happened to also get sea sick, so they were usually close to land. While on his purging adventures he noticed species evolve. He saw some lizards at a particular island without webbed feet, and maybe notice one with webbed feet. When he came back a few years later to the same place, he noticed that all of the lizards he saw had webbed feet. Selecitve breeding is also another huge part of evolution. The male lizard that had webbed feet was more of a pimp daddy then the rest of the lizards, so all the chicks wanted to do him. You can use your imagination from there.
I don't know what your trying to preach, but that doesn't make any sense...
The theory of evolution points to "creatures" evolving over long periods of time. Not a matter of years. C'mon dude. Thats like a black person marrying a white person. A chinese marrying a black or white person. That's not "evolution", that is called "breeding". Maybe in the long run when the race has been wiped out due to interracial breeding, whether it be reptiles, mammals, marine life, etc they will deem it "evolution".
What you guys think?
When you decide to spout off, throw out some factual links to your information.
Josh
SLK 32
Quote:
Scientology? OMG, another man-made religion. This is ridiculous!! There's enough confusion as there is and now we have this...
hmmm.. you are complaining about scientology and evolution being man-made religions being forced on us... YET you agree with regular religions, which are MANMADE as well, being taught in schools?? What makes Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism whatever right and scientology and evolution wrong? They were all manmade, what belief on this Earth isn't?
Quote:
Evolution? I personally don't like it. People call it science, I call it crap! People might not want to accept it but Evolution is not science, it's a religion. A religion that's gone too far as to force itself upon everyone. You have more people believing we evolved from a fish, monkey, etc..more than we have people that believe in God. Why are we allowing this crap into our schools to corruption, pollute and destroy the minds of our children.
Evolution is FAR more science than the crackpot theories made up by creationists... do you actually know any science? Scientific theory involves observation, hypothesis, testing, and theories, followed by fact. Hmmm, despite the fact that evolution is indeed a thoery, it is based on plenty of scientific fact (genetics, plate tectonics, geology, biology, chemistry, physics). The reason we cannot make it a fact is that we do not have a time machine to go check if this stuff happened! The evidence however is heavily in favor of evolution and an Old Earth.
As for creation, what do we have... the Bible... thats it, a book written by people who meant well but were writing a history book, not a science book. They throw in some fantasy (Noah's flood, Creation) just like EVERY OTHER RELIGIOUS text in the world, and then the rest is more believable history (most of the Bible) There is no evidence to support creationism so Creationists just try and disprove evolution... that's all they can do cuz they have no theory to stand on...
By the way, this issue has been discussed before in excrutiating detail
FireCav98 wrote:Scientology? OMG, another man-made religion.
all religions are man made
You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan
(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)
I don't find anything more rediculous about Scientology than Christianity.
I personally don't think that any "religion" should be taught in school, period.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
After reading all of this to get caught up I must agree with the statement that ALL religions are man-made. Just because you believe that the man who made it may be the son of god or a profit still makes it man-made so thats a silly thing to even say.
Evolution has been discussed here before, I said it then and I will say it now, THERE IS NOT ENOUGH PROOF TO SUPPORT EVOLUTION . All it is is a theory there is not enough evidence to support it and there is not enough to dismiss it either. So in my mind the juries still out. Religion is a VERY touchy subject I think that there is something but who knows what or whos version of the bible is correct so the way I look at it who am I to tell anyone that they are wrong or right so I try to keep my mouth shut.
I do however think that if they want to teach this stuff in schools they should at least touch on ALL the different beliefs even if only for a week at a time No one religion is more right then another so why should any of them be excluded.
Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.
In my opinion, and this is if religion is not to be allowed to be taught in school, then the Big Bang theory, evolution, etc should not be forced upon anyone as a fact either. I am Christian and I don't believe in the Evolution theory. Now don't get me wrong. I'm not niave. There is evolution going on all around us. Mutated things and crap, just not on the level that Evolution theories are trying to push. I just don't believe that man evolved from an ape, and so on down the line.
As for religion in school, honestly I think it would never work. Schools would have censor it, twist it into curriculum, etc. and that defeats the whole purpose of the idea anyways.
Just my 2 cents
ShiftyCav wrote:thats probably the dumbest thing i have ever heard. you should take that serpentine belt and wrap it around your neck.
