Ok in tuning the QBE im running into a few roadblocks its either too rich out of boost or too lean in boost. Using shifted's formula for 650cc injectors the constant should be at 0.06885. Starting up the car its fine but the problem im running into is that in adjusting VE i seem to be running out of range, the VE offset in the airflow tables is 30% which means that the lowest cell can be 30 and the highest is 130
With the constant the same 0.06885 i can get the car to run the lower range just fine but as soon as the car hits boost its needing 130 or more in the histogram in VE tuning in open loop, I had the power enrichment target set at 11.7AFR, so in order to add more fuel I bumped up the constant to .113000 now its rich enough to run 15psi in some rpm ranges but wont idle for crap because a setting of 30 is the lowest amount a cell can have entered in. I tried messing with the IPW Multiplier vs. Vac table but that made things even worse, so i just have it set to 1.0 the whole way accross.
Another problem is that the commanded AFR is 14.0 out of power enrichment, this used to be 14.6, there doesnt seem to be any table to move this back to normal 14.6
Basically I cant seem to make it not rich out of boost and not lean in boost
I have some ideas on how to balance it out a bit better, I can move the constant back down some and then set the power enrichment richer than the 11.5 its set at now, or I could try adding some pulse to the IPW Multiplier vs vac in the last cell that is marked 0, which seems like that as soon as you hit atmosphere it would run that pulse command, but if none of those things works Im really at a loss on how to get this to work, is what we are trying to do here even possible with HP tuners or is 15psi on an eco just out of its range?
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
just out of curiosity, are you on stock fuel pump only???? I k now injectors/FPR have been upgraded, but waht about your pump????
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
stock pump, doesnt have a problem at all....
LE61T PTE6262 Powered 
the problem is in lamens terms is that, when we tune for high boost, I am extremely rich out of boost in all conditions. I can't rev it without it sputtering all the way up to redline. Now if we tune it for great Af's out of boost I run lean in boost.
There has to be some sort of trick to get it to work great in both scenarios....
LE61T PTE6262 Powered
Fuel pressure is not an issue as its on a stock regulator
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
Rodimus Prime wrote:Fuel pressure is not an issue as its on a stock regulator
What!!!! What does that have to with the fuel pump????? What is your fuel PSI in boost???
QBE (The Boosted One) wrote:the problem is in lamens terms is that, when we tune for high boost, I am extremely rich out of boost in all conditions. I can't rev it without it sputtering all the way up to redline. Now if we tune it for great Af's out of boost I run lean in boost.
There has to be some sort of trick to get it to work great in both scenarios....
Sounds like you are not tuning your VE/PE correctly..... Get the car running right "out" of boost forst, then work on "in" boost...
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
When we start working in boost it affects my outta boost
LE61T PTE6262 Powered
it has nothing to do with the fuel pumps or fuel pressure as a shortage of fuel isnt the problem
its obviously a VE problem, I dont think your understanding the purpose of the post or the question itself so unless you have something relevant to add, dont bother posting
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
beofe when we were tuning for high boost (15 psi) my top end VE needed to be 180 with my constant set at .06xxxx which made my LOWEST possible ve number 80 (throwing me TOTALLY off out of boost)
So then we tune for out of boost by upping my constant giving us a little more fuel per VE value, but that affected it even worse.
what we're trying to figure out is how to tune for 15 psi and still have very near perfect out of boost values AND in boost values.....
LE61T PTE6262 Powered
Rodimus Prime wrote:it has nothing to do with the fuel pumps or fuel pressure as a shortage of fuel isnt the problem
its obviously a VE problem, I dont think your understanding the purpose of the post or the question itself so unless you have something relevant to add, dont bother posting
Figure it out on your own then...... You can be an a$$, I dont care.. All my cars and my customers cars run great.... You were asking for help, I was trying to give it.... Obviously you DONT know what you are doing... You seem to "think" you do though.... You can't just go changing constants after tuning it and thinking its gonna be "tuned" right...
Phil, I hope you get it running right..... Might need somebody that doesn't have such a "chip" on their should and "know-it-all" attitude though....
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
as soon as Philbert fixes things we can try again
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
I know im a dumb ass that bondos a turbo together (true story) but mabye you should try rasing your fuel pressure with the accel (I think thats the one)
please take it for what its worth as dumb as I am I do know a thing or two about tuning, and I think I can help a freind.
heres why
from what I can see, your basiclly hitting a brick wall. everyone knows that aside from all the plus's that hpt has, its downfall is the 1 bar tuning. so what you guys do is strech out your tables and fake the bar sensor. this works for so long but upon pushing it two far, you start to strech out your parameters and loosse the tune.
regardless (and this is the part I really want you to look at)
you said something that sparked my interest. you noted that bumping up the constant on your injector helped the problem. this is because your rasing static fuel and basicllly pushing more fuel threw the injectors at the same given value. I.E. still sticking with 130 value but getting a whole lot more out of it.
yet the car woulndt idle becuase it didnt know what size it was.
SO, this brings you to your dilema. how do you throw more fuel at the injector, and still keep it on the same constant based ve table?
raise your fuel pressure under boosted load.
rasing your fuel pressure whlie the car is hitting boost will put more pressure on the injector causing it to get more out of the same duty cyclye. so you can keep your constant but still have the fuel in the top end
let me know if this makes sense I can try and reword it if it doesnt.
"
boobs now with Riboflabin"
well i have been tuning my car and i ran into the same wall. i raised my multi on the ipw multi table at 0 vac. that helped. now i have a boosted tune. but my problem is i cant floor it through 1st. it will bog bad. i raised my fuel pressure also. helps a little.
DRIVE HARD OR DONT DRIVE AT ALL!!!
Im telling you an afpr would patch things up a bit.
"
boobs now with Riboflabin"
what is it that pj always says about blind monkeys and bananas?
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
Put a fuel pressure gauge on it. If your VE is workig intermittantly, or dumping in tonnes works up top and not down below, and you are getting sputtering you are likely losing pressure. The stock s/c VE will easily run you up to 210kpa with out issues, your AFR's will be everywhere but it will run fine. What is your injector duty cycle?
HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED
put it this way. in 3rd and up i can boost all the way through. i dont kno about 2nd, lost it. basically u have one ve table, i kno there are more just bare with me. so when ur tuning the higher gears. and u get them tuned. that same tune will be for 1st. which doesnt make the same amount of boost. and doesnt spool as quick. so when it looks at x rpm and x tps, and the boost isnt there then it will flow too much fuel. and my fuel pressure is fine. have a gauge. but if u dont turn up the injector pulswidth at 0 up the ur caused to turn up the ve offset high and that cause's a @!#$ty tune out of boost. which is the problem we are haveing.
DRIVE HARD OR DONT DRIVE AT ALL!!!
your have an in-car fuel gauge??
HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED
yep
DRIVE HARD OR DONT DRIVE AT ALL!!!
CAVI.DEMON wrote:put it this way. in 3rd and up i can boost all the way through. i dont kno about 2nd, lost it. basically u have one ve table, i kno there are more just bare with me. so when ur tuning the higher gears. and u get them tuned. that same tune will be for 1st. which doesnt make the same amount of boost. and doesnt spool as quick. so when it looks at x rpm and x tps, and the boost isnt there then it will flow too much fuel. and my fuel pressure is fine. have a gauge. but if u dont turn up the injector pulswidth at 0 up the ur caused to turn up the ve offset high and that cause's a @!#$ty tune out of boost. which is the problem we are haveing.
by looking at the tune you sent me, you have your IPW multipler set too high at 0 Vac... You have not modified anything on your PE Multiplier vs RPM.... I really dont see why you hve the VE Offset set so high either...There are other things that Im questioning, but I have already emailed you about those...
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
glad this thread is getting noticed, maybe we will get some help.
My next question, if I were to get like a 2:1 FMU wouldn't I need to get a fuel pump too? I am really trying to not have to drop the tank....
LE61T PTE6262 Powered
at 15psi boost, you are likely running 60+15 = 75psi fuel pressure, if you install a 2:1 (over riding the factory 1:1) you willup that pressure to 90psi, in 2000-2002 the pump (if dead headed) will only pump to 72-73 psi, so 90 would require either inline or new intake, just a thought.
HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED
