I've read the VE tuning FAQ and its quite helpful - just to put that out there.
I'm working toward the following: LE5 intake mani, 62mm TB, intake, pacesetter header and comp stage 1cams. I've alrady got a highflow cat and 2.5" pipe. I'm thinking that spinning 7000rpm on this set up will require at least an upgrade to ss/sc injectors (30lb/hr?).
So how skilled does one need to be to street tune a setup like this? I'm thinking its not going to be that bad, because none of these mods are MAJOR airflow increasing mods. I'll probably do everything but the cams first and get the injectors dialed in, then move on to the cams. That will space out the $$ from the wallet too
How would spark timing change with the addition of cams? There really is no FAQ on spark timing, and I'm not a big fan of "just advance until you see knock and back off two degrees". Is this dialed in by dyno tune only, or can I get a reasonable gain in street tuning the spark advance?
Thanks man, i'll be looking you up when I get to that point. Great to know there's help if i need it. I just got the intake and 62mm TB installed, and I dont know where people come up with this low end torque loss @!#$...it pulls from 2.5k rpm to the top. Next up is the 2.4 mani...then injectors and HPT, then cams.
I have some stock SS/SC injectors i been looking to get rid of, they are actually 34.1 lbs per hour, they would also connect to your stock harness
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
Rodimus Prime wrote:I have some stock SS/SC injectors i been looking to get rid of, they are actually 34.1 lbs per hour, they would also connect to your stock harness
Arent they a different dimension though? i searched those and it seems like a 2002 fuel rail conversion is necessary. I was thinking more like bosch 440's/ green tops that would be easiest and there is plenty of experience with those injectors on n/a beasts
If I'm wrong about the fuel rail conversion...name a price.
oldskool wrote:Rodimus Prime wrote:I have some stock SS/SC injectors i been looking to get rid of, they are actually 34.1 lbs per hour, they would also connect to your stock harness
Arent they a different dimension though? i searched those and it seems like a 2002 fuel rail conversion is necessary. I was thinking more like bosch 440's/ green tops that would be easiest and there is plenty of experience with those injectors on n/a beasts
If I'm wrong about the fuel rail conversion...name a price.
440's are probably too big, you'll have a hell of a time getting them to idle good. LSJ's should do you fine, and they WILL fit your fuel rail.
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The ss/sc's will work as long as it's in the 02 rail. They are too short for the 03+ fuel rail.
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Yeah, Raven and I tried putting the SS/Sc ones in an 03+ rail and they're too short. The 02 rail is lower
2003 White Cavalier LS Sport Coupe
Stitch wrote:Yeah, Raven and I tried putting the SS/Sc ones in an 03+ rail and they're too short. The 02 rail is lower
That's what im talking about
And I'm not saying Joey is right or wrong regarding the 440cc/min injectors, but I recall a specific member here that was able to get them to idle and perform just fine. Also, they are cheap and easy to come by.
Thanks everyone.
Electrical Tuning > Mechanical Tuning
440s with hpt will idle fine as long as you get your injector constant correct.
Skunk wrote:The ss/sc's will work as long as it's in the 02 rail. They are too short for the 03+ fuel rail.
Not so. Done it without changing anything but the injectors on a 03+.
FU Tuning
John Higgins wrote:Skunk wrote:The ss/sc's will work as long as it's in the 02 rail. They are too short for the 03+ fuel rail.
Not so. Done it without changing anything but the injectors on a 03+.
Care to elaborate? Head modifcation? Rail modification?
Skunk wrote:The ss/sc's will work as long as it's in the 02 rail. They are too short for the 03+ fuel rail.
it can be done.
oldskool wrote:John Higgins wrote:Skunk wrote:The ss/sc's will work as long as it's in the 02 rail. They are too short for the 03+ fuel rail.
Not so. Done it without changing anything but the injectors on a 03+.
Care to elaborate? Head modifcation? Rail modification?
there's a thread in ecotecforum.com. cody from rdfabs posted it. plus phlatcav did it too, and a couple of others.
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So what injectors swap directy into the 03+ rail and the stock harness? Saab maybe?
oldskool wrote:So what injectors swap directy into the 03+ rail and the stock harness? Saab maybe?
I'm doin a similar thing on the sliver cav. I got the LE5 intake, Rk wai, Pacesetter header and will have 2.5 exhaust. What injectors can swap directly into the 03+ rail and harness....also are LD9 injectors any different than the SS injectors off a balt?
I fured up.....meant to say the LD9 supcharger kit injectors different that the SS balt injectors...
A member measured the o-ring to o-ring on the LD9 s/c injectors and said they were about 2.75", with is a little over 60mm. In that case they should fit. I do not know about the electrical, but it should be easy enough to get a set of pigtails from a junkyard LD9. The more pricy option are ford red tops (30lb/hr, EV1 i believe) that will run about 150/ set of 4 on ebay and you still need the pigtails.
The ld9 injectors have the same exact plug as the lsj injectors. Many people including myself have swapped out the ld9 sc injectors for lsj's, lsj's are just a bit shorter.
what i saw with using LSJ injectors was guys 'floating' the plastic spacer under the injector in the head to seal against the last o-ring.
not something I'd do.
if you open up the holes on the rail so you can move it closer to take up the space, I'd buy that.
most seimens injectors fit pretty nicely.
Ecotec fuel injector dimensions
DaFlyinSkwirl wrote:
2002 ecotec injectors:
overall injector length: 2.871" -or- 73mm
center o-ring to center o-ring: 2.494" -or- 64mm
2003-2005 ecotec injectors:
overall injector length: 3.124" -or- 79mm
center o-ring to center o-ring: 2.653" -or- 62mm
smallest aftermarket injector I'd use with a 03-05 rail:
bosche (ford) 440cc green top injectors:
overall injector length: 3.041" -or- 77mm
center o-ring to center o-ring: 2.579" -or- 65mm
Not to be an ass, but 2.653" converts to 67mm for the 03-05 injectors
It is sounding like LD9s/c injectors are plug and play? PJ what was the max IDC's you were seeing with the 440cc/min injectors? The calculator at RC engineering said 310cc's are good for close to 200bhp, but i only want to upgrade once.
Well if the lsj's use the l61 plug, then ld9 injectors will plug right up. That is good incase you ever do need more fuel and get rc's or something you have to use a pigtail with so you wont have to re-splice.
I wouldn't worry about getting the 440s to idle correctly. I have my 750s idling just fine... well at 975 rpm.
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