OK I've got a tuff decision to make and I have tried to weight out the Pro's and Con's but they just stay even! So I came to you guys for your take on them...which one would you get? The Benz is about 13hp lower.....the price is about 300 dollars cheaper (base model) the beamer...well its sexy...but so is the benz....ok i give up...you guys decide ...seriously...you guys WILL make the decision for me. Thanks!!
BMW..
Mercedes has done nothing to impress me lately and from everything I've heard hasn't really been the BMW competitor that they were ever since they joined with Chrysler.
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Gotta say the BMW. 2001 BMW 330i will most likely be my next car if anything happens to the Integra. I might take a CLK430 or something over the BMW, but not the C230.
First, which model year Benz were you looking? For 2006 I-4 SC is gone, now you get a 2.8L V6 based on the 90 degree 3.5L V6 making 201HP.
I still rather have the I-4 because i felt it moved quicker and more importantly the gas mileage is better.
Now which would I pick?
When it comes to performance, (I drove the 330i so it is not fair) its the BMW. More importantly, the handling was by far the best handling car i have ever driven in a while and i have tested lots of cars.
At the track, you steer and with no fuss, the car just goes there and it felt so composed, this car lives up to the "ultimate driving machine" slogan. The I-6 engine was sewing machine smooth.
The Benz got a new tranny for 2005 (manual) and it really improved the fun-to drive factor tremendously. Exterior styling on the Benz is way nicer IMO then the the 06 BMW. The C-class has been the most reliable in the Benz line-up.
I would take the Benz just because of the exterior styling. IMO is way better and while both interiors looked flimsy, the Benz's design looks to be less cheap looking (for its price) then the BMW's.
BMW has it set for fun-to drive factor, but I personally don't think i can live looking at its design inside and out.
good luck
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
If you are talking 06 models.....BMW hands down!
My wife and I are looking to buy an 06 325xi in the spring.. Go and test drive them. We loved the BMW better and it was cheaper than the Benz!
Yes I was looking at the 2006 models. But now there's another problem .....the new Lexus!!!!! Geeze........................Thanks for the opinions.....keep them coming!
So it's 2 for the beemer................1 for the Benz.
I assume you mean the IS350..
I haven't even seen pics of them yet, not that I've gone looking..
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If the Lexus is in the running, it wins, hands down. Affording the payments on a Benz or Bimmer is one thing; you need to factor in the costs of upkeep and repair on these cars, which will eat you alive, if you're not prepared.
I wanted to suggest this car, but it was not in your options.
IS250: 2.5L V6 204HP@6400 /185tq@4800
IS350: 3.5L V6 306HP@6400 /277tq@4800
Based on the on a shortened version of the Lexus GS platform. Its 3.5in longer with a wheelbase that grows about 2.4ins.
Starting price should be around under $30K for the IS 250 & around $35K for the IS 350.
If you want more info, I have some preliminary factory info. The car will go on sale in Oct of this year
Brew-san here are some... .
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
ZlineDavid wrote:If the Lexus is in the running, it wins, hands down. Affording the payments on a Benz or Bimmer is one thing; you need to factor in the costs of upkeep and repair on these cars, which will eat you alive, if you're not prepared.
Very true, M-B does not include maintenance in their waranty as they did in 2004 and under. BMW does though.
Let me tell you, relibility is not generally good on German cars. That being said, at work I have heard horror stories on BMW's relibility and have seen some very bad things with Benzs that should not happen. But like I said before, the C-class has had a good run, mostly because it does not have over-engineering gadgets like the E-SL-S-CL-SLK-class has. Another good part of Benz is their Diesels
But I would strongly consider the Lexus!
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
that Lexus is HAWT! although the tails look a little too Accord/Sonata for me.
as far as which car I would pick... Bimmer
Very cool.. Thanks for the pics Goodwrench! Not quite as distinctive as the IS300's when they came out but they look like a nice car.
I heard that they aren't gonna be available in a manual when they come out (possibly a year or so later just like the IS300s)..
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ZlineDavid wrote:Affording the payments on a Benz or Bimmer is one thing; you need to factor in the costs of upkeep and repair on these cars, which will eat you alive, if you're not prepared.
Not really an issue anymore. BMW offers Full-maintanence for 4 years or 50,000 miles.
"Full Maintenance includes items that need replacement due to normal wear and tear, provided wear and tear exceeds BMW specifications. This includes items such as brake pads, brake rotors, and wiper blades that are not covered by the original New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
Any adjustments required due to normal operating conditions are also included."
Looks better than the Lexus...IMO.
<img src="http://www.bmwusa.com/NR/rdonlyres/29814513-3979-4F8F-81D9-8DDAD0298F38/0/0644_07.jpg">
^The IS250 will be only one to have a 6-speed manual. The rest will be autos. Also with this IS, there will be the option of AWD too.
From the looks of it, it seems this car will be the class standard, the suspension is new in the rear too, multi-link instead of wishbone, this setup will improve on its already above average handling.
I really would like to see how it fairs with the BMW 3-series, which is now very very impressive in lot of its characteristics.
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
That's great, if you can afford the vehicular downtime as well.
geeze.....I've never heard bad things about the beemers....always thought they were the BAR when it came to the sports sedans. Looks like the beemer is winning this battle though. The lexus is a close second and the benz...well......I think I have put a red line straight through that one. Lexus has always produced a great car with high resale value. In the 30,000 dollar range....would there be any other cars that would have more bang for my buck? Not really looking into the fastest....more luxury. Well there is always the Chrysler 300...but thats a midsize sedan. Keep the opinions coming guys!
Thanks for the info goodwrench. *sigh* I guess Lexus decided to take GM 's approach and offer their performance cars with an auto only ..
Wiezer Wally, I'm not sure how they compare to the BMW or Benz or Lexus but a Cadillac CTS might be worth a look. An Audi A4 maybe? (it's also got the option of AWD but the non AWD ones are FWD).
I notice that we've only been talking about RWD sport sedans, but you say that you're not really interestd in the fastest. Is RWD (or AWD or FWD) something you're looking for? If it doesn't really matter a TSX or TL might be worth a look (depending on which side of that 30K you're leaning towards). And that's not just an Acura bias I think the TL is one of the nicest looking sedans out right now.
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No problem^^^
Wiezer Walley wrote:geeze.....I've never heard bad things about the beemers....always thought they were the BAR when it came to the sports sedans. Looks like the beemer is winning this battle though. The lexus is a close second and the benz...well......I think I have put a red line straight through that one. Lexus has always produced a great car with high resale value. In the 30,000 dollar range....would there be any other cars that would have more bang for my buck? Not really looking into the fastest....more luxury. Well there is always the Chrysler 300...but thats a midsize sedan. Keep the opinions coming guys!
Like I said, german cars are not the most reliable around. The stories I heard came from my co-worker that worked with me. He worked as a parts guy himself in a BMW dealership for 16 yrs.
The reason I suggested the Benz was because of its styling (which I could live with) and the car has been dependable in the line-up. BMW, when everything is working, it works beautifully, but the the styling for me is odd looking IMO although way better then the rest of BMW's Chris Bangle sedans it just does not flow as nice as the 1999-2005 design.
Other cars to look at , I gotta agree along the lines with brew-san except for the Audi A4. If you look at the A4, just save your money and go for VW, yes they are that close. The 2005 AWD 3.0L i drove felt rubbery in its suspension I t did not feel like a $35K should. Although being AWD, in this car you can feel its roots being FWD first. inside the car it is well laid out with probably interior in the class.
Another car to look at is the Infinity G35, its loaded. The only thing I found it to be, it ride to on the luxurious side compared to the BMW. The car has lots of torque, which it is very fun. Best of all it can all be had for about $30K.
If I were to rank the near luxury cars by price, performance, value and reliability.
1.Lexus Is350<< 306hp and Lexus quality/ resale, need I say more?
2. Acura TL<<< this car has almost no options and has 270HP standard
3.Chrysler 300C<<340HP v8 option low $30K with a ride that is smooth
4.Infinity G35<< loaded and can be had for like $28K
5.Cadillac CTS 3.6L (tied)<<< Will get a new suspension set-up for 2006. Unique styling, very competitive.
5.BMW 3 series (tied)<< the standard for chassis and powertrain engineering
6.Mercedes Benz C230 (2006)<<< not to crazy for the new V6, but a solid performer
7. Saab 9-3,<<<< wait for the 2.8L v6 turbow/250Hp
8. Volvo S40<<< does not catch up to these guys^^^
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
You guys have been great help! Thanks a million for all of the insite and opinoins and advice.
I do have a slight problem with the cadillac though. The resale value drops so bad! I saw on that was 2 years old selling for 1/2 of the sticker price of a new one. Thats just losing too much value too fast for me. I think I'll look into that infinity. Oh, and My price range is leaning towards the lower part of the 30K range. Thanks again!!!
Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:Like I said, german cars are not the most reliable around. The stories I heard came from my co-worker that worked with me. He worked as a parts guy himself in a BMW dealership for 16 yrs.
The reason I suggested the Benz was because of its styling (which I could live with) and the car has been dependable in the line-up. BMW, when everything is working, it works beautifully, but the the styling for me is odd looking IMO although way better then the rest of BMW's Chris Bangle sedans it just does not flow as nice as the 1999-2005 design.
Other cars to look at , I gotta agree along the lines with brew-san except for the Audi A4. If you look at the A4, just save your money and go for VW, yes they are that close. The 2005 AWD 3.0L i drove felt rubbery in its suspension I t did not feel like a $35K should. Although being AWD, in this car you can feel its roots being FWD first. inside the car it is well laid out with probably interior in the class.
Another car to look at is the Infinity G35, its loaded. The only thing I found it to be, it ride to on the luxurious side compared to the BMW. The car has lots of torque, which it is very fun. Best of all it can all be had for about $30K.
If I were to rank the near luxury cars by price, performance, value and reliability.
1.Lexus Is350<< 306hp and Lexus quality/ resale, need I say more?
2. Acura TL<<< this car has almost no options and has 270HP standard
3.Chrysler 300C<<340HP v8 option low $30K with a ride that is smooth
4.Infinity G35<< loaded and can be had for like $28K
5.Cadillac CTS 3.6L (tied)<<< Will get a new suspension set-up for 2006. Unique styling, very competitive.
5.BMW 3 series (tied)<< the standard for chassis and powertrain engineering
6.Mercedes Benz C230 (2006)<<< not to crazy for the new V6, but a solid performer
7. Saab 9-3,<<<< wait for the 2.8L v6 turbow/250Hp
8. Volvo S40<<< does not catch up to these guys^^^
To expland on what Goodwrench is saying,
1. Lexus looks to have a real winner in the is350 now if only they offered it in a manual.
2. To clairify something by no options on the TL I think Goodwrench is implying is that it comes more or less fully loaded. The only real option that I know of is the navigation system.
3. I like the way they look and with the Hemi it definitely makes power but I've heard they don't drive all that well, of course if you're looking for a soft luxury ride it might not be an issue for you.
4. I considered suggesting this as well but I love the coupe and the sedan is looks like a poor imitation of one which bugs me. If you're looking for AWD this does have it as an option (G35x) but from what I've heard it isn't all that great.
5. This is the car that really made Cadillac a BMW and Benz competitor. As with all GM's yes there is a resale value hit but most of that is due to the incentives offered. Buy the car for less resell for the car less that's just the way it goes.
5. The 3 series is a nice car and has been a nice car for some time and in the past was really a benchmark in the sport sedan market. I just don't think they've stepped up as much as some of the others cars on this list have. I personally don't mind the Bangle designs, they aren't as nice as the previous ones but they are as hideous as the Bangle haters make them out to be. I meanwhile don't really care for any of the recent (or almost any) Benz designs though.
6. As I said I don't care for the styling, I also don't really consider Benz even on the same level as BMW, their quality on the whole seems to have gone downhill, but Goodwrench says that the C-series are holdingup well and I trust his opinion.
7. no comment
8. The Volvo just doesn't come across as quite as luxurious or as powerful as the others on this list.
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^