Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster? - Other Cars Forum

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Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 1:49 PM

Story found here.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0810_2009_corvette_zr1_vs_porsche_gt2_vs_ferrari_599_vs_nissan_gtr/index.html


There is no denying that the ZR1 is astonishing quick and a real work of art. BUT looking at the stats to it's competition (Lambo should be there too) you would think it would be even faster. Pricing aside, look at hardware only. Ferrari weighing in 611lbs more 26 less horses and 156 ft-lbs less of torque, the Ferrari stayed neck and neck through out the straight line. The same with GT-R with 158 horses and 174 ft-lbs less and still 462lbs heavier, still manage similar performance. Porsche has the engine in the back, therefore has advantage for straight line and it is lighter by 94lbs, here being RWD it does not carry the burden of the GTR's AWD. That being said, Porsche with a lot less power, both had very similar times?
In the end with all the extra power, better tires, re-tuned suspension using sophisticated hardware, it still manage to post similar times to a Z06. I dunno I was expecting a sizable lead over the competition and Z06. Especially being a supercharged 600+ HP/TQ and a low weight. I dunno could it be the tires (run-flats still) that is holding out the ZR1 real capability?
What do you all think?



>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----


Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 4:04 PM
gearing in the final drive and trans have alot do with it

from the other zr1 post , the WHP #s are a little low , plus the run flats are crappy tires at best







Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 4:07 PM
[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]gearing in the final drive and trans have alot do with it

from the other zr1 post , the WHP #s are a little low , plus the run flats are crappy tires at best

i 2nd that...


and i still would take the porsche (if i had the money of course)



Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 4:43 PM
[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]gearing in the final drive and trans have alot do with it

from the other zr1 post , the WHP #s are a little low , plus the run flats are crappy tires at best

Tires yes, I don't think it is the final drive though.


ZR1's close-ratio six-speed manual

Gear ratios (:1):
First:
2.29

Second:
1.61

Third:
1.21

Fourth:
1.00

Fifth:
0.81

Sixth:
0.67

Reverse:
3.11

Final drive ratio:
3.42




Base and Z06
Z51 Performance Package


Gear ratios (:1):
First:
2.66
2.97


Second:
1.78
2.07


Third:
1.30
1.43

Fourth:
1.00
1.00

Fifth:
0.74
0.71

Sixth:
0.50
0.57

Reverse:
2.90
3.28

Final drive ratio:
3.42
3.42






>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----

Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 5:05 PM
adding to yours instead of making a new one.. ZR1 knocks 4 seconds off Nürburgring

Quote:

Back at the Nürburgring, the hot Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 has just ripped four seconds off its claimed 7:26 lap. The new time, with Jan Magnussen at the wheel, is a claimed 7:22.4 for the full 12.93-mile loop. While the number is pretty bloody fast, it is still .3 seconds off the time earned by the Dodge Viper ACR (ouch, those three tenths really have to hurt!). We take these lap times with a grain of salt, as we've yet to see everyone on the 73-turn course under the same conditions, and with officially certified timing equipment. Again, so you don't have to Google the competition's best-claimed Ring times yourself, here they are: Porsche GT2 - 7:32, Nissan GT-R - 7:29, Corvette ZR1 - 7:22.4 and the Dodge Viper ACR - 7:22.1


http://www.autoblog.com/2008/10/28/corvette-zr-1-knocks-four-seconds-off-ring-time/


---I am parting out!!!!---
12.5@116 2.0 60ft
Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 5:19 PM
Most likley a traction issue with the ZR1. Im sure if you throw on a nice pair of Pirellis like the GT2 is using the ZR1 would shave some time off those numbers. How are the widths of the rear tires of these four cars? I know the ZR1 is 225 or 235 are any of them over 235?

The GT2 is rear engine RWD with great tires so traction is awesome.
the GT-R is AWD so tractions no issue there. Plus the trans is auto shift manual and that does save time when u got a good auto trans
The Ferrari is also auto shift manual. So time is saved there also. I know price should cum into play but, for $300k+, i hope its fast as sh*t.

I say its all a traction issue with the ZR1. Take all four of those cars on the same tire, ZR1 would walk even further away.




Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 5:40 PM
911 GT2 uses front: 235/35 ZR19 and Rear 325/30 ZR19 on Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires.
ZR1 uses Front: P285/30ZR19 and Rear: P335/25ZR20 on Michelin Pilot Sport 2 tires.

Both have outstanding Michelin tires, but to my understanding the only difference is that the ZR1 are runflats.



>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----

Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 5:55 PM
lol yea i meant to type 325 or 335
225 is a small rear tire for that much power. Then there would be a huge traction issue.

The pilot sport cup is a DOT approved race tire. is the sport 2 the same just in a runflat version?

http://www.michelinman.com/tires/ultra-high-performance-sport/pilot-sport-cup/ <--- sport cup tire info

Couldnt find sport 2 on the muchelin website.



Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 6:40 PM
I don't know why you would think it would be even faster? When your running it mid-low 11 second quarter miles on showroom stock tires (hell on any tires) it takes ALOT more power to drop a few more tenths. Its not like a 16 second car where an intake and exhaust will gain you half a second, a 50 hp advantage is minimized real quick on cars like this. At that level of performance I'm not surprised at all to see the numbers grouped so close together, there comes a point where your not going to get a stock 50 state legal car with a warranty any quicker.

Going off the specs the ZR1 should be the fastest... and it is.



Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 7:43 PM
Sunb1rd (loves Game Fuel) wrote:[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]gearing in the final drive and trans have alot do with it

from the other zr1 post , the WHP #s are a little low , plus the run flats are crappy tires at best


i 2nd that...


and i still would take the porsche (if i had the money of course)


thats my sig you thief lol



. member 1244or55
.http://www22.ocn.ne.jp/~cavalier
Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 7:57 PM
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/showthread.php?t=1541575

Wonder what the ZR1 would do on DR's




Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 3:54 AM
Darkstars wrote:I don't know why you would think it would be even faster? When your running it mid-low 11 second quarter miles on showroom stock tires (hell on any tires) it takes ALOT more power to drop a few more tenths. Its not like a 16 second car where an intake and exhaust will gain you half a second, a 50 hp advantage is minimized real quick on cars like this. At that level of performance I'm not surprised at all to see the numbers grouped so close together, there comes a point where your not going to get a stock 50 state legal car with a warranty any quicker.

Going off the specs the ZR1 should be the fastest... and it is.

Well the ZR1 has 133 more HP and 134 more of torque set with better tires. With that being said, I was expecting a 11 flat 1/4 mile as a Zo6 does it in 11.6 and 3.0 sec to 60 as the Z06 has been recorded at 3.4 secs from C&D. But my biggest concern is as to how the porky Ferrari was neck and neck while still being down in power too. Yes, the tranny helps, but that is not enough to hide the 611lbs weight difference.




>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----

Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 4:20 AM
i say the zr1 has major traction problems. Mainly due to the fact that is has kind of street tires and no weight out back. The ferrari on the other hand has the motor in the back but does weigh more. So all in all light is faster but your comparing to different drive train cars. The weight distribution on the vette probably is more to the front so it more than likely has poor traction and in the turns wants to spin out. The ferrari on the other hand all the weight is in the back which should give it better traction out of the hole and in turns.

That's how i see it at least. Get the vette some way better tires and some more down force out back so i gets traction like the rest. Or more weight out back and i figure it would rape the competition.
Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 6:07 AM
Just looking at the trap speed tells me that the ZR1 is having trouble putting it's power down. Look at the GTR, which has AWD, it's going 120mph through the quarter while the Vette is almost 10mph faster. What you're seeing is a car that's bogging off the line then making up for lost time with brutal acceleration. Yeah, it should be faster.

I think what we're seeing here is the limitation of a front engine/rear wheel drive layout in a "normal" street car. (Note: I use the term loosely to denote that at 3300lbs it weighs about as much as a normal family sedan) I also think the the split second that the supercharger uses to spool up could be affecting times. The other cars also have extremely fast shifting trannies compared to the ZR1s traditional clutch operated design. Again, we're talking split seconds, but those add up at these speeds.
Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 8:34 AM
Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:
Darkstars wrote:I don't know why you would think it would be even faster? When your running it mid-low 11 second quarter miles on showroom stock tires (hell on any tires) it takes ALOT more power to drop a few more tenths. Its not like a 16 second car where an intake and exhaust will gain you half a second, a 50 hp advantage is minimized real quick on cars like this. At that level of performance I'm not surprised at all to see the numbers grouped so close together, there comes a point where your not going to get a stock 50 state legal car with a warranty any quicker.

Going off the specs the ZR1 should be the fastest... and it is.

Well the ZR1 has 133 more HP and 134 more of torque set with better tires. With that being said, I was expecting a 11 flat 1/4 mile as a Zo6 does it in 11.6 and 3.0 sec to 60 as the Z06 has been recorded at 3.4 secs from C&D. But my biggest concern is as to how the porky Ferrari was neck and neck while still being down in power too. Yes, the tranny helps, but that is not enough to hide the 611lbs weight difference.


going off what you just said , its in the gearing of the ZR1 , the higher numeric gearing in the Z06 means the motor isnt working as hard , where the ZR1 has to work harder to move it along , which is what cars under boost like , granted turbo cars like it alot better than a s/c does

Z06 have been in the 10's with sticky tires and nothing else , im sure once a few people get some sticky rubber under the ZR1 , itll run atleast mid 10's , if not low 10's

the porsche is more likely optimized better with its gearing , plus a better weight distribution for straight line






Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 11:08 AM
Factor in the price and the ZR-1 is really putting a hurting on the porsche and ferrari



Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 3:36 PM
As was stated above, put drag radials on the back of the ZR1 and you're deep into the 10s, deep into the 10s.

Wasn't there a guy that managed a 10.9xx on a stock C6 Z06 with drag radials?

So given the power difference, 10.4s anyone?






Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 3:44 PM
DR's should help and it's still a badass piece.
Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 4:22 PM
You have too look at it from all the angles really. THis Vette has done 2 things compared to its predecessor.

1. IT is a better ride. PERIOD.
2.IT is faster.

It's 0-60 is in the same category as the others massively due to a few factors... Engine location, tires, gearing, transmission efficiency. Add up all of this and YOU see that it is STILL REGARDLESS an amazing piece of engineering.

Cheers !



My Cav
I give up...
i'm buying a VW those people love trees, so they should love eachother too... "Andy"
Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Thursday, October 30, 2008 4:40 PM
Blown Phoniex wrote:i say the zr1 has major traction problems. Mainly due to the fact that is has kind of street tires and no weight out back. The ferrari on the other hand has the motor in the back but does weigh more. So all in all light is faster but your comparing to different drive train cars. The weight distribution on the vette probably is more to the front so it more than likely has poor traction and in the turns wants to spin out. The ferrari on the other hand all the weight is in the back which should give it better traction out of the hole and in turns.

That's how i see it at least. Get the vette some way better tires and some more down force out back so i gets traction like the rest. Or more weight out back and i figure it would rape the competition.

The Ferrari has the engine in the front.



>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----

Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Friday, October 31, 2008 2:41 PM
KFLO wrote:As was stated above, put drag radials on the back of the ZR1 and you're deep into the 10s, deep into the 10s.

Wasn't there a guy that managed a 10.9xx on a stock C6 Z06 with drag radials?

So given the power difference, 10.4s anyone?


I posted the link above. A guy from corvetteforums ran a 10.85 @ 129mph on a stock ZO6 with dr's.




Re: Shouldn't the ZR1 be faster?
Friday, October 31, 2008 9:31 PM
Sweet, thanks for allowing me to not click your link.






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