5spd shfting problem - Transmission Forum

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5spd shfting problem
Tuesday, December 13, 2005 12:38 AM
I have a degree in automotive, and I know all about how a standard transaxle works but I have no experience with front wheel drive or this specific tranny and I've run into a problem I'm stumped on. Sorry for the long post I just want to include everything I know so maybe someone will know how to fix it.

I'm working on my sister's car it is a 98 cavalier rally sport 2.2L with 5spd(Isuzu) manual. The trans seized up, I did the R+R, shop rebuilt the trans. Now about once or twice per week the trans seems to be popping into 2nd when shifted in and out of reverse. When you shift into reverse(possibly 5th too, but not while moving) and back out the shifter gets stuck. I'm not sure if it's when you shift into, out of, or while in reverse. The shifter will still move side to side from 3/4 detent and back to 5/R and will still go in and out of R but will not go into 3,4, or 5, even after rolling the car. When its like this neutral is a foward gear(pretty sure 2nd) and reverse kills the engine. It does the same thing whether the shift cables are connected or not. I then have to remove the shifter(the one on the trans, not interior) then pry the top(1/2) gear selector back to neutral, reinstall the shifter and its fine again for a while. At first it did it about every other time you selected R, now it's more like once a week, if it was my car I'd probably just live with it for a while, it kinda seems like its getting better, but my sister can't be stuck wrenching on her car when this happens.

That's the problem in a nutshell here's all the background on whats happened so far:

The trans started leaking and was not noticed, it ran out of fluid and it locked up both wheels going about 45-50mph. So I get a call from my sis, she's freaking out, says everything on her car just froze while driving, she tells me her brakes and steering locked, engine and electrical all died and swears all 4tires skidded to stop, and car won't move. It was late evening, and the roads were wet and icy, so I'm still assuming just the front 2 wheels locked, engine died and killed power steering, alternator, and such, and she just thought everything froze due to the violent stop. Before i got there a guy with a truck stopped to help and pulled it just a few feet to get it out of traffic. Apparantley the wheels broke free when pulling it off the road, car started right up, and everything felt fine at stop, so I drove it home about 1-2miles. I could feel alot of resistance to get it going and keep moving, but the clutch,shifter, and gears all seemed to work right. After disassembly I find rear bearing on main shaft seazed and got hot enough to weld itself together, then it broke loose and chewed up the case and a thrust plate, as well as caused alot of discoloring on a few parts.

I was planning to do the rebuild myself but I couldn't find a manual or any in depth info on this trans, and the GM shop manuals are kinda pricy. Plus while looking for parts found a shop close by that does nothing but rebuild standard trannys for other shops. They don't do R+R, or anything dealing with the vehicle, but they quoted a rebuild with 1year warranty for similar price to what I figured it would cost for me to rebuild it. This is exactly what is on the invoice:

Isuzu FWD 98 Cavalier Dissassemble clean and
Inspect Replace rearcase cluster 3rd L+H
Idler Gear 5th Rev Interlock and 3 4 shift fork
Replace bearings and syncros
UNITS SHIPPED DRY - Use 10/30 Synthetic Motor Oil Only

I know that the bearings and syncros are new parts but not sure if the rest is reused/used/new/reman or what, or if this is even the same trans or a core. There were no added charges for parts, and no breakdown or subtotal of costs just the price I was quoted after describing the damage over the phone. I simply didn't think to ask about that stuff until after there was a problem. I did question the motor oil for fluid, my manual for the car says use GM syncromesh or something like that, but was told 10/30 full syn is definitely what to use so thats whats in it.

Everything went back together just fine except the little clips that hold the 2 shift cables in the bracket that bolts to the trans, I guess my dad just pryed the cables off the bracket instead of releasing the clips and broke em. I managed to use some zip ties to secure them and I've double-triple checked to make sure they don't move and have full motion, so I don't think thats the problem, but I suppose it could be. Any thoughts on that?

After talking with the shop a few times one of the techs there thought he could fix it by welding on the shifter, he said thats a common fix for a different trans that this one's based on. He added a bit of metal to the flat sides on the half rounded arm of the shifter that moves the gear selectors inside the trans. I noticed that he ground the sides flat all the way across and originally those sides had a little taper in opposite directions. I don't see how this even has potential for fixing this problem, and don't really know if it would because things are way off in there now. 1/2 and 3/4 select fine but now the arm is too wide and is grabbing the edge of the 3/4 selector when you try to shift into 5/R. Does anyone think this is the solution, I just need to grind down the width of that arm till it just barely clears all 3 selectors, or will that not accomplish anything? I don't see how the thickness of that arm will effect the 1/2 selector when its in R and theres the 3/4 selector between them. Do you think maybe a new shifter is needed? He said they can't get them anymore, thats why he tried to fix it, but I bet I could find one somewhere.

Ok thats all I got, again sorry for the length of this post, I'm just really lost at this point, and I always want to understand the how/why rather than buying parts it doesn't need. If this thing was in my camaro I'd just drop it out quick and take it back, but these little FWD cars are 10lbs of stuff in a 2lb bag, so I'm gonna make sure the thing NEEDS to come out before I dive in again.

Re: 5spd shfting problem
Tuesday, December 13, 2005 6:09 PM
I had almost the same thing happen...... when shifted into reverse while rolling, you get stuck in 1st and reverse....... sounds like one or two detent balls were not installed when the trans was put together........ Once I pulled it back apart, I found I missed one...... installed it, and never had the problem again.




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