i am saving up to turbo my car but i have an auto......i was wondering about swapping in a 5spd manual with new clutch and flywheel but if i just put a new torque converter and a b&m shiftplus i dont know which one will be harder to do or more logical. i want the most power transfered to the wheels efficiently. Would just keeping the auto get the same effect as the manual with all the upgrades.

its really up to you. search a little and you will find out that it is a complete pain from what i hear to swap to a manual. so the real question is, do you want to be able to shift your car. if you do, then trade your car in and go get a manual. if you want to stay auto, then i would recomend getting a few things for it, and calling it good. again, it all depends on what you want.

I know a stock auto tranny can only hold 199.12 foot pounds of torque. Shift kit helps the line pressure, preventing slipping. I was considering the same option as you. I also have an automatic transmission. If you torque is going to reach over 199.12 foot pounds torque don't count on that transmission to hold up. I also researched into building up my auto transmission with a better valve body, bearings, torque converter, shift solenoid, bushings, pump, steel plates and special clutch yet the cost was around 3,000 usd plus shipping, core, and install ( Very nice, but way too expensive ). I still want to convert my transmission to manual but my problem is money. Otherwise I'd beef up my auto transmission but living in Toronto, Canada and most of these companies are in the USA.

Hope I was Helpful....

Richard.

thnks for the input ...i guess im better off getting a manual if im gonna get more power...considering its much cheaper than 3k plus i get to shift myself
josh

so you are saying the auto even with a new yank torque converter could only handle 199 ft lbs of torque

no offense but that is crap. look for glowincav's car. he has an auto, ran a 13.8 or 13.9, and when he dyno'd it to tune it at the time it was putting down 203 to the wheels. of course he upped the boost and was running more then that, but i would have to say that is false. the only thing he had was a shift kit to help prevent from slipping but other then that, his has held up fine. plus i have always heard that auto's are stronger then manuals, i can't say for sure, but i would research that last part.

Richard wrote:I know a stock auto tranny can only hold 199.12 foot pounds of torque..

ok seriously if you dont know what your talking about then STFU. there are many auto's on this site with well over 200hp. and if you do some research you would find out that the auto's are actualy stronger than the 5speeds in jbody's. thats why this site is so pathetic there is so much miss information, if people wouldn't pull #'s out of there ass when they have no idea what there talking about everyone would be better off.

get a autotrans interceptor and you should have no problems, if you want later on you can get a higher stall torque converter that would be nice to have. but i know after turboing my car i love having the auto and wouldn't trade it for a 5 speed any day

Derek Z24 wrote:

Richard wrote:I know a stock auto tranny can only hold 199.12 foot pounds of torque..

ok seriously if you dont know what your talking about then STFU. there are many auto's on this site with well over 200hp.

He said torque

Sorry Derek, it's just so easy

thanks derek...that didnt make any sense to me either ...then i saw your profile and knew you were running more than 200 or close so needed the extra input..

josh

BradSk88 ! wrote:

Derek Z24 wrote:

Richard wrote:I know a stock auto tranny can only hold 199.12 foot pounds of torque..

ok seriously if you dont know what your talking about then STFU. there are many auto's on this site with well over 200hp.

He said torque

Sorry Derek, it's just so easy

same thing
but seriously were the hell did he pull 199.12 out of, people that don't know what there talking about and spreading miss information just piss me off...

Derek Z24 wrote:

BradSk88 ! wrote:

Derek Z24 wrote:

Richard wrote:I know a stock auto tranny can only hold 199.12 foot pounds of torque..

ok seriously if you dont know what your talking about then STFU. there are many auto's on this site with well over 200hp.

He said torque

Sorry Derek, it's just so easy

same thing
but seriously were the hell did he pull 199.12 out of, people that don't know what there talking about and spreading miss information just piss me off...

Excuse me... I called GM Head office, becasue i called about 15 gm service centers and they didn't know nothing.... I talked to a person at gm head office and they took 4 days to get back to me with the information.. and actually the transmission is based on newton meters ( meters becasue i am in canada ) 270 newton meters = 199.12 lbs torque... I am sure the line pressure can be increased with B&M or Autotrans, but that only helps keeping the transmission from slipping, that doesn't give the transmission more torque..... 199.12 STOCK

I am new HERE, but i've been working on my cav for 3 years. i am trying to give and receive PROPER information...

Torque and HP are the same thing? You better check yourself...

first of all, hp and torque are different. i'm sure you knew that though, and were just referring to the fact that if you are putting down well over 200hp, your putting down over 200 tq. but anyways, i know i had read something before about how they origanally thought that the auto trans could only hold a certain amount (don't remember the # though), but that was passed by more then one person.

ok...first you have to consider the numbers are coming from someone in gm...prob someone that doesnt care and made up a number..and did they say the tranny wont hold 199 lbs torque referring to it slipping or blowing all to %#*$? In other words did they specify how it wouldnt hold the torque...what is the weak point.

I called the gm head office rep... they took all my information, including the VIN for my 1996 2.2l coupe auto 4 speed... they didn't know the information right away they had to call me back, and it took 4 days... I am sure if they were making up a number they would have made it up right away? why would it take 4 days to make up a number like that? The information I got was that the transmission can safely hold 270 Newton Meters. I converted 270 newton meter into foot pounds of torque and got 199.12 lbs torque. I hope you're not hating, becasue I am just trying to help. That is just the information I got from GM.. Have your car dyno'd you know how much torque your putting to the floor.. it is a complete waste of time trying to guess what you have. period.

gm does not know how much power that trany can take, i gaurantee they just made that number up. look around, there are people with auto's running low 13's and that takes more than 200hp... and i know torque is different from hp im not an idiot

do you have any first hand experience with how much power they hold? just cause you have been "working" on your car 3 years doesn't mean you know anything about it or are pushing the limits to see what it can do, and there certanly is no set breaking point for a trany, you cant say it won't hold more than XXXhp


and back to the original topic, its also a good idea to get a trany cooler when running alot more power and drive it hard, heat is what kills auto's

thanks..yeah i was getting that too...maybe the b&m cooler

are we all talking about the 4t40e...anyways it doesnt matter...im not trying to fight with anyone but i think ive got all the info i need....thanks

hey derek, i can tell your not an idiot and that you know that hp and tq are different, i'm just making sure that anyone who is not familiar with cars understands that they are different.
also, please don't go off what one person tells you. either research it to death, or figure it out for yourself. just like i would not just go off this one post, i would keep searching and learning more. i'm not saying i gave wrong info, i'm just making sure no one f*cks there car up.

Derek Z24 wrote:gm does not know how much power that trany can take, i gaurantee they just made that number up. look around, there are people with auto's running low 13's and that takes more than 200hp... and i know torque is different from hp im not an idiot

It definately does take more than 200hp, but it doesnt neccesarily take more than 200lb-ft of torque. You can have very high horsepower and relatively lower torque and still be very fast in a straight line. A perfect example of this is the Honda S2000. it ran 14.1 with 150lb-ft, against the 350z's 14.3 with 274lb-ft. In every head to head test ive seen, the cars that can rev high buy make low torque tend to win in the 1/4 mile. Now i know these are not cavys or sunfires but they show a trend in 1/4 mile times.

btw my source is R&T august 2003

oh i know...thats what ive done for a lot of stuff ive done to my car...i just couldnt find more posts on it in the search area, i was just trying to get as many people to respond to this as possible with what they think is right.
thanks all

I'm onto DerekZ24 side. Autos can handle WAY more power than you guys are mentioning. I can bet you that it can put down over 250 HP with no problems (which I plan on doing).

And when Derek said "torque and hp were the same thing" he was saying in a joking manner. More than likely, if your putting over 200 HP on our motors, your running 200 or more lbs of torque to the wheel.

Back to what cheedo1 was asking...

It would be much cheaper and more cost efficient to keep the auto and put the torque converter to what mods you have and what you plan on doing in the near future. I did the numbers and it's way out of my price range to find all these parts and have someone install it for a reasonable amount. It's not worth it to me to spend that amount of money when I can build up this tranny that can handle more power.



www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

If you spend time at a dyno you'll know a dyno measures torque not horsepower. Horsepower is a mathematical equation which is proportional to rpm and torque. You'll NEVER see a practical automobile engine that makes a ridiculous amount of horsepower and no torque. The advantage to the auto is the torque multiplication of the torque converter and the lock up on the converter. I have seen as much as 2psi more boost on my turbo car with a auto in lock up over a manual trans with no other adjustments. Plus if your racing you can power brake and build boost from launch. In controversy the stick is more efficient and costs you less horsepower to turn. I'd stick with the auto and a converter with a tranny that is in good shape. As for what GM said BS they just don't want you to use their product for something it wasn't intended and blame them for a crappy product.

so what can i do to to really build up ma auto tranny

escobano wrote:so what can i do to to really build up ma auto tranny

Here is your answer:

NJs Honda Killa wrote:It would be much cheaper and more cost efficient to keep the auto and put the torque converter to what mods you have and what you plan on doing in the near future.

And to add, you can also get an Auto Trans Interceptor to increase line pressure. If you want to really get into your transmission, contact a transmission shop and see what you can do to upgrade parts.



www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

Yes i know that horsepower is a function of torque and that theyre equal at 5252RPM. Mathematically it is very possible to have a ton of MAX horsepower in relation to max torque. But you;re probably right about it being on practicle set-ups.