I've been working on my turbo setup and I've almost got everything completed, but I have yet to choose the turbo that I want to run. As of now I'm building the manifold and everything around a Mitsubishi turbo, but I'm using the turbo off my Eclipse now that the 4G63 has decided to munch itself into oblivion. I've been looking into the VNT style turbo that Dodge used on some of the Daytona Shelbys and the Shadow CSX. I understand that Garrett has continued to manufacture these turbos and I was wondering if anyone has ever used one and how well it worked. If I read correctly, it's essentially two turbos in one due to the variable pitch fins inside the housings, giving a fast spooling small housing at low rpm and a high flow large housing at higher rpm. Am I right about this? And are there any out there with mitsubishi style flanges so I don't have to rework my manifold? It wouldn't be hard, I just don't want to.
"Silly cluth, glazing is for donuts!"
All I can add to this is that the vnt turbos are know by those in the dodge shelby seen as the best. Ask on some Daytona Shelby boards. I know mitsubishi turbos were used on some daytona shelbys, just not the specifics.
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I checked around a bit on the web and I managed to find that the Shelby turbos were made by Garrett. But if I'm not mistaken they have their own flange design. Thanks for the input tho. It sounds like a good idea for a daily driver, especially if one wants to balance the car for drag AND road racing. Quick spool and big boost is something I've chased for a long time and the VNT seems like a safe way to go. It's also my understanding they don't have to be gated, which simplifies things a little. Still checking into that part.
"Silly cluth, glazing is for donuts!"
the vnt cars had a garrett, they also were a modified t3 flange (offset holes) if sized proerly they dont have to have a wastegate but it wont hurt to have one for high power applications. here is a diagram of how it works for anyone whos interested. it more or less changes the A/R of the turbine allowing for more controll over turbine speed.
This isint an example of the garrett turbo found on K cars but its a good clean explanation of how VNT works.
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basically the same way a hybrid turbo works.
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Quote:
basically the same way a hybrid turbo works.
If you mean hybrid as in a t3/t4 ,they do not work the same.
those turbos are bad ass. The turbo boost at very low rpm and the veins move and boost stays constant throughout the rpm range. Good luck with buying one of those im pretty sure the cost of them is crazy high but if you can get one go for it id love to see the torque curve vs boost curve
*2012 mazdaspeed3*
Robbie c wrote:Quote:
basically the same way a hybrid turbo works.
If you mean hybrid as in a t3/t4 ,they do not work the same.
Hes right they dont work the same. A hybrid turbo just has two different housings the vnt turbo uses veins to control the amount of exhuast gases it uses to spin the turbo so yeah way different but they are both good in there own ways.
*2012 mazdaspeed3*
How is the boost controlled on the VNT turbo? I know its through the vains, but does it take a special computer setup or does the vain actuator act in the same way as a wastegate?
O noes!
Smokey wrote:How is the boost controlled on the VNT turbo? I know its through the vains, but does it take a special computer setup or does the vain actuator act in the same way as a wastegate?
adjustable internal wastegate
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We managed to find a complete VNT equipped Daytona in Wisconsin for 250.00 as a parts car, but by the time my friend found the money to buy the car, we couldn't find the ad again. It was on the web and I'm guessing he sold it. I've seen a few others just the turbo alone was going for 450-600, but considering the cost for a typical turbo, I'd say it's a good deal. I've been seeing some stuff on the web about SR20 guys using VNTs on their cars, and Garrett is apparently spending a large chunk to develop them for diesel trucks in Europe, so maybe they have some in production.
"Silly cluth, glazing is for donuts!"
Actually Spotabee, the Dodge VNT style doesn't have a Wastegate. Maybe it varies by design?
O noes!
Waste of time.
Just buy a properly sized turbo in the first place and don't worry about it.
The VNT turbo used by Dodge has an electrical solenoid to control the vane changes. Good luck figuring out how to control that.
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Smokey wrote:Actually Spotabee, the Dodge VNT style doesn't have a Wastegate. Maybe it varies by design?
I see. Looking at that picture in the first post, I just saw the wastegate... so yea. I dunno lol
I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
The Chrysler VNT's were very unreliable.
The vanes and the mechanisms work well in a diesel application were exhaust temps are relatively low.
But in a Gasoline application they cant reliably take the heat.
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Mr. Pute wrote:Waste of time.
Just buy a properly sized turbo in the first place and don't worry about it.
The VNT turbo used by Dodge has an electrical solenoid to control the vane changes. Good luck figuring out how to control that.
The solenoid could be a neat trick to make work properly, yes. But there are other VNT's out there from my understanding that are designed for gasoline engines. The idea of finding a properly sized turbo isn't always easy. I'm still in an experimenting with this as I'm building my first Cavalier. So with that in mind, if I'm looking for quick spool for autocross/road racing and decent boost levels for high horsepower (dragracing), what do you recommend?
"Silly cluth, glazing is for donuts!"
Mr Clean wrote:Mr. Pute wrote:Waste of time.
Just buy a properly sized turbo in the first place and don't worry about it.
The VNT turbo used by Dodge has an electrical solenoid to control the vane changes. Good luck figuring out how to control that.
The solenoid could be a neat trick to make work properly, yes. But there are other VNT's out there from my understanding that are designed for gasoline engines. The idea of finding a properly sized turbo isn't always easy. I'm still in an experimenting with this as I'm building my first Cavalier. So with that in mind, if I'm looking for quick spool for autocross/road racing and decent boost levels for high horsepower (dragracing), what do you recommend?
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The Chrysler VNTs do not have a wastegate. If you're going to run one from a Chrysler, make sure you use an external wastegate. They're decent turbos, but like was mentioned before, have longevity issues.
Their spool time is ridiculously low though.
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Mr Clean wrote:The idea of finding a properly sized turbo isn't always easy.
How do you figure???? There are at least 100 turbocharged J-Bodies on this board that have already done the hard work for you!
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