I need some info before i make a big purchase.
I f i get a port M62, with a 3.1
Do i need a retune? I wouldn't be making that much more power that i should be scared?(stock bottom end)
Any long term benefits(i know cooler IATS)
I just can't find a direct answer
Thanks
Mods: Synapse Charge Piping, Short Throw, Bad-Mab Dp, Dejon Intake, BYT Tuned!
Parts For SALE! Pacesetter Header(ECO),17'in Resonator, Alternator, Starter, Viper Alarm.
Its just makes lower IATs since the air isnt being stuffed through a small hole the supercharger still only flows 62 cfm hence the M62.
You think thats worth the money?
Mods: Synapse Charge Piping, Short Throw, Bad-Mab Dp, Dejon Intake, BYT Tuned!
Parts For SALE! Pacesetter Header(ECO),17'in Resonator, Alternator, Starter, Viper Alarm.
Depends how high your IATs are. My friend ported his M90 on this own. Cant say it helps for sure. How much is porting running these days?
how much more money is it than just buying an unported m62. Your overall cost is going to be the cost of the ported blower minus what you sell your blower for plus shipping and stuff.
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
Leafy wrote:how much more money is it than just buying an unported m62. Your overall cost is going to be the cost of the ported blower minus what you sell your blower for plus shipping and stuff.
Unless he send his out to be ported. I know The Green Bastard does a lot of M90 porting. Id hit him up for any of my porting.
i'm seein 11-12 lbs on a Stiegemeier ported blower and 3.1 pulley. you may not need a retune per se but to get the benefits of a ported blower, a retune would be better.
have you read the
RULES yet?
my carDomain updated 6/11/10 Forged and Supercharged
TheSundownFire (GME Chat) wrote:Its just makes lower IATs since the air isnt being stuffed through a small hole the supercharger still only flows 62 cfm hence the M62.
NOt sure this is true. My understanding, is that a ported blower floes more air (cfm's) but does it at less PSI!
EvoFire wrote:TheSundownFire (GME Chat) wrote:Its just makes lower IATs since the air isnt being stuffed through a small hole the supercharger still only flows 62 cfm hence the M62.
NOt sure this is true. My understanding, is that a ported blower floes more air (cfm's) but does it at less PSI!
Ive heard different but I could be wrong. Wouldnt it flow the same air at less PSI therefore lower IATs because the air isnt being pushed together as much going through the blower outlet.
CaliforniaDomestics wrote:
Anyway I ported the SCer to keep my SCer RPMs within a happy medium of RPM range and efficiency. By doing this it was an awesome increase in CFM. I know this because I tested it by not changing my fuel system prior to install of the ported charger and i went from a good 11.5:1 A/F to around 13:1.....
Here is my reason for thinking that a ported blower will change the CFM. This is talking about the blower that will be on my car.
The way I see it, is that the area pre rotors is bigger, allowing more air to enter, and the area post rotors is bigger aswell, letting more air to leave. This means that the blower is pushing the more air into bigger area. That in turn is more CFM's, but less PSI.
EvoFire wrote:CaliforniaDomestics wrote:
Anyway I ported the SCer to keep my SCer RPMs within a happy medium of RPM range and efficiency. By doing this it was an awesome increase in CFM. I know this because I tested it by not changing my fuel system prior to install of the ported charger and i went from a good 11.5:1 A/F to around 13:1.....
Here is my reason for thinking that a ported blower will change the CFM. This is talking about the blower that will be on my car.
The way I see it, is that the area pre rotors is bigger, allowing more air to enter, and the area post rotors is bigger aswell, letting more air to leave. This means that the blower is pushing the more air into bigger area. That in turn is more CFM's, but less PSI.
But you are not changing the area of the blower that actually moves the air.
its an old concept. time for something new to take the reigns. - Z yaaaa
I'm sorry, the mp62 is a fixed displacement blower, with a fixed displacement of 62 cubic inches. This means that it moves 62 cubic inches of air for each revolution. It has 3 lobes on 2 rotors therefore each lobe cup thingy (cant think of technical term) displaces 10 1/3 cubic inches. Unless you make that last number bigger you wont be able to flow any more air without adding more lobes or more rotors.
The pressure drop is due to the temperature drop. Air is an ideal gas (or close enough) so PV=nRT (Pressure * Volume = amount of substance [in moles] * the universal gas constant * Temperature) appies. In our case we're dealing with a mass flow in a control volume so the verstion of the ideal gas law we will use is Pv=RT (Pressure * specific volume [in in^/lb] = the universal gas constant [in moles/lb] * Temperature) since we cant change v and we cant change R that means a temperature drop reduces the pressure in the system. Since porting the blower increases its efficiency (by reducing turbulence and other bad stuff at the blower exit) it reduces the amount of heat added to the air (and that makes for not as hight of a temperature). Since the temperature is lower the pressure is lower because the volumemetric flow rate is not changed and R cannot be changed.
And this is my 2nd to last post for this month so questions of my math will likely have to be answered by pm.
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
This is all true on the stock pulley.
A ported blower on a smaller pulley will move more air why else would people pulley down?
per revolution (of the rotors) the m62 moves 62 cubic inches of air. well with a smaller pulley, the rotors move faster and more per revolution of the pulley...
lol we are all just talking here. basically to asnwer the question, the 3.1 is about the limit for a stock blower, so i think with a ported blower, you would probably need to tweak the tune/ add more fuel.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.
You pulley down so that the blower moves more air per one revolution of the engine of the car. No matter what you do to the blower you will not move more than 62 cubic inches of air per 1 revolution of the blower.
But the ported blower will get more air into each cylinder of the engine because the air is cooler and has a higher specific volume once it has made it to the head. Doing the math for a blower system is very confusing because the blower does not actually compress the air, the air does not become compressed until it reaches the plenum of the intake manifold because a positive displacement blower is not a compressor. BUT the blower can only move so much air per revolution so that why the formulas work the way they do, by the time the air is to the intake valves you'll actually be getting more air into the cylinders because the air has a lower specific volume at that point. this is why adding a heat exchanger lowers your boost level but increases your power. The cylinder can only take a certain volume of air, but the more mass of air you stuff into it the more power. The volume of air moving through the blower is the same the mass of the air that ends up making it into your cylinders goes up when you port, same as when you add a heat exchanger.
Then when you pulley down you just make the blower move more volume when compared to the volume the engine is moving. The blower moves 62 cubic inches per revolution, the engine moves 67 cubic inches per rev (thats 134 cid/2 because the engine is a 4 stroke). That means to produce any positive manifold pressure the ratios between the blower and engine must be greater than one. And then the higher the ratio the more air the blower is flowing than the engine is flowing the higher the manifold pressure.
Thats enough Thermodynamics for the night.
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
yes it will flow alittle bit better seeing as there is less restruction befor and after rotors. lower iats do to it being lorted inside. and lower iats do to it being show polished outside since the powder coating holds heat in more then bare aluminum.
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2623318
Yeah less PSI but more power beings it flows easier, cooler and faster
Buy the m62 and port it yourself. My Dad did my m45 way back in the day. Piece of cake. No way would i pay steg to port it if you were thinking that. Just too much money to run low 13's lol
Its kind of goes against what you would think. Like Leafy said 62 cubic feet per revolution, smaller pulley means more revs per rev of the engine thus creating more heat. Porting allows the air out of the compressor area quicker. There isnt more air there. Its just under less pressure.
I agree that its easy to port your own blower. Just takes a steady hand and some time.
i sent it to stegemier because they are certified to rebuild the superchargers so i had them port and polish it and also show polish it why they had it. the sc now has a wopping 200 miles since they rebuilt it.
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2623318
