I am swapping 00 Malibu 3100 into my 98 cavi with a 5-speed. I am planning to piggy back the wiring harnesses. I have read that I must delete the A/T codes from the 3100 pcm for this to work. My question is why? What happens if I don't? I am planning on unpinning the wires that I'm not going to use from both harnesses. Also can anyone point me in the right direction when it comes to HP tuners. I know very little about tuning and I would love to learn but most of the stuff that I am reading about it is so complex that I am lost before I get started. Thanks for the help!!!

You need to delete the auto tranny codes because the ECM will be looking for the auto trans if not, and in most cases will cause it to run in a type of safe mode to avoid damaging the tranny. One thing about your ECM is that I believe that one will run the gauges without a problem, but it hasn't been tested yet. If you have problems with the gauges, you'll want to get the ECM reflashed for an Impala and then have the tranny codes deleted.

If I remember correctly, the 00+ Malibu 3100 has the same mount as the 00+ Grand Am/Alero 3400. If so, you may want to check out the GP I have running for the piece to make this a bolt in. There is info on them in this forum, and the GP is running right now in the GP forum.

Good luck with your swap. I have the '02 3100 swap in mine, and I've been very happy with it so far. Most go for the 3400, but the 00+ 3100 is a great engine with almost the same power.

Thanks I have been getting a lot of info from your posts. None of this would be possible for me if it were not for you guys. I just saw the mounts for sale today and last friday I built mine and put the motor in. OOPS! I should have waited but any way. Do I have to buy hp tuners to delete the A/T codes or is there a way around that? I was planning on buying it but I wanted to wait untill its turbo time and I was hopeing to learn more about tuning befor then. I right now only have about 870 bucks in this whole project and I am nearing completion so I would love to keep it as cheap as possible. I am also painting the whole car my self getting some new wheels, a wire tuck and a little interior work before the car goes back on the road. I was planning to use the 2.2 harness for my fuel gauge speedo, and temp. then use the malibu harness for engine mangment. Is there an easeir way? I have read a little about the Impala PCM and using the 00+ gauges but since my car is a 98 I would have to rewire the whole car right?

when I put my 2000 grand prix 3100 engine in I did not have to remove the a/t stuff to make it run, - no limp mode either- I did later "fool" the pcm into thinking it was in 'drive'

Quote:

I was planning to use the 2.2 harness for my fuel gauge speedo, and temp. then use the malibu harness for engine mangment. Is there an easeir way?

-- should do fine just make sure you have wiring diagrams for both harnesses
your 3100 motor will need a temp going to it's pcm, I welded in a new bung for it in the crossover tube, others have used a 3 wire in the existing spot
have fun, and document your wiring, makes it easier if you have problems



jb aka thebondoman

Hey thanks for the info, thats what I had come up with as well was just trick the computer so that it always thinks its in drive. Do u have any pics of the temp sensor setup? Also what about vats? or passlock or should I have any problem with ne of that?

yea on grandamgt.com there is a 30somthing page thread about doing a f40 tranny swap but they show how they trick the grand am tranny to work fine. they jump a few wires.

Stephanie Smith wrote:Do I have to buy hp tuners to delete the A/T codes or is there a way around that?

Well, as John Beers said, he did it without deleting the codes. However, as far as having them deleted, I know that some guys have just sent their ECM to a tuner shop to have it done. I believe Milzy is one of them. I don't remember how much they said it was, but it wasn't bad.

Stephanie Smith wrote:I was planning to use the 2.2 harness for my fuel gauge speedo, and temp. then use the malibu harness for engine mangment. Is there an easeir way? I have read a little about the Impala PCM and using the 00+ gauges but since my car is a 98 I would have to rewire the whole car right?

Somehow I missed the part that your car was a 98. I was thinking it was an 00+ vehicle. So yes, piggybacking would be the route to go unless you went with aftermarket gauges or rewire your car for 00+.

Thanks you guys I will try to keep you posted and get some pics of the progress. If I have anymore problems.

Can you explain more about tricking the ECU into thinking its in drive? I need to do this to my car.


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

Oedwards wrote:Can you explain more about tricking the ECU into thinking its in drive? I need to do this to my car.

I don't have a range switch diagram to look at. By my guess is that you ground a particular wire and the computer belives that it is in drive all the time.

My question is, how does this would as far as having a safety for keeping the engine from starting while in gear? Or is the clutch switch still working properly? I know with my car the clutch switch is separate from the engine harness.





i find it amusing that SHOoff has nothing better to do but follow me around & be an unhelpful dick in even cross-forum. - Jon Mick

alright, I have a wiring diagram for a 94-95 grandam so I will look it over and figure out what wire I should ground. Thanks man.


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

On my first V6 swap I used a 94 grand am ECU and didnt do anything for the auto tranny. It worked perfect with my 5 speed and never gave me a CEL.

Although the swap Im working on now will be using 00+ wiring, 99 alero ECU, and HPT.

RedCavalac wrote:On my first V6 swap I used a 94 grand am ECU and didnt do anything for the auto tranny. It worked perfect with my 5 speed and never gave me a CEL.

Although the swap Im working on now will be using 00+ wiring, 99 alero ECU, and HPT.

But I am still automatic and dont have overdrive and i dont think the convertot locks up, I messed up the wiring on the gear selector when I put it in the car and I think the problem is the ECU doesnt know when im in drive, I have first and second but nothing past that.. unless i hold it to the floor all the way though second it will shift to third, untill i let off the gas that is.


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

Oedwards wrote:But I am still automatic and dont have overdrive...

If you did a V6 swap with a 3 speed auto, I don't know that you're ever going to get it working right. As far as I know, there isn't an ECM that is set up to run the V6 and a 3 speed. Your ECM is messing up your shifts because it's trying to control a completely different tranny.

I see, well thats why Im glad I went with a manual. Oh and the fun factor too.

At one point I had all of the diagrams for that year but are long gone now. Good luck

[If you did a V6 swap with a 3 speed auto, I don't know that you're ever going to get it working right. As far as I know, there isn't an ECM that is set up to run the V6 and a 3 speed. Your ECM is messing up your shifts because it's trying to control a completely different tranny.]


From what I gather he is using an OD trans but its not shifting up that far, they are electronically controlled. If he had a 3 speed it would shift fine assuming the vacuum line is hooked up to the modulator. May not have tcc lockup though.

I don't think the 3spd has a modulator does it? Isn't it all done through the kickdown cable? Might be a little extra mod to hook up there for the kickdown, but can't be much.

Quote:

But I am still automatic and dont have overdrive and i dont think the convertot locks up, I messed up the wiring on the gear selector when I put it in the car and I think the problem is the ECU doesnt know when im in drive

Does your VSS go to the 3100's PCM? Or does it go to a factory PCM to run the gauges? Cuz i've heard that the electronic trannies will do this if the computer isn't getting a VSS signal.







i find it amusing that SHOoff has nothing better to do but follow me around & be an unhelpful dick in even cross-forum. - Jon Mick

Both the 3100 pcm and the original pcm are getting VSS signal. I have the 4t60e tranny. First gear is fine, I assume it shifts to second. I have been told TCC feels like another shift, so I don't know if its 2nd gear or TCC. I know the converter is not locked because when I am cruising at a pretty good speed I will let off the gas and it will drop strait to idle and the car is just coasting, this is really bad for gas mileage.


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

Wow, you have a 4t60 and it's not coming out of 2nd. That sounds like you've either got some wires crossed, or as SHOoff suggests, maybe a signal isn't getting to the 3100 ECM. Are you sure that it's getting the VSS signal? Since you're running piggybacked, the thing is that you can't know if it's getting the signal because your gauge is working, since that's being controlled by the 2.2 ECM.

I would really try to get that hooked up to a scanner or a data logger if you can.

I have the VSS wires split, going to each ECM, when I first drove the car I didn't have the VSS hooked up and it wouldn't go out of first. I know the 3100 ECM doesn't know I'm in drive, I am missing wires on the gear selector. I would really like to hook them up but I don't know what wires go were on the ECM, and the wiring diagram I have doesn't show me colors, just were the wires go. Like I know were they go on the ECM, the diagram tells me that, but I don't know what wire is what on the selector, so I don;t know where they actaully go. Hope I made myself clear lol.


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

Can I use this? The colors don't match up however.

http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache:sxPx1uOAx8AJ:www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com/download/db/TCM4101SCH.pdf+4t60e+transmission+diagram&hl=en&gl=us


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

Oedwards wrote:Can I use this? The colors don't match up however.

http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache:sxPx1uOAx8AJ:www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com/download/db/TCM4101SCH.pdf+4t60e+transmission+diagram&hl=en&gl=us

After reading what you posted two hours ago, I'll say that you need to learn to read a wiring diagram. If you don't have the pinouts, then that is what you need to get your hands on, as it will show you not only the wire colors (which should be in the diagram), but also the pin numbers on each connector that they go to.

You don't need a separate trans controller.

Oh, I thought that was a wiring diagram for a 4t60e. I want to just swap a 5 speed in. It is absolutely %100 necessary to weld a new tranny mount in the car right? just making sure, thats what I got from reading the forum.


- Your not-so-local, untrained, uncertified, backyard mechanic. But my @!#$ runs

Oedwards wrote:Oh, I thought that was a wiring diagram for a 4t60e.

That was the wiring diagram to a tranny controller.

Oedwards wrote:I want to just swap a 5 speed in. It is absolutely %100 necessary to weld a new tranny mount in the car right? just making sure, thats what I got from reading the forum.

Yep, that's the only way. Even if you're planning on swapping to a manual, it isn't a big fix to get yours wired up right in the mean time. If you can't find the wiring diagram, I would hit up a dealer and see if they will print it out for you from the computer. I'd be surprized if they wouldn't. Or better yet, get a factory service manual for the car your ECM comes from. You can usually find them on ebay for $20-30.

thus is why people that don't know shouldn't do. i wasn't sure my first time but once i got doin the harness i was like oh yeah this goes here and there and yaddy yadda.

IMO piggy backing is stupid the info is there to swap the 00 style gauges with an impala program and you got functioning gauges the amount of work it will take to swap dash harnesses is way less then piggy backing the only thing a j body PCM is good for on a V6 swap is a paper weight or a trash can filler. i charge double when doin a piggy back harness i price it high so i never have to do it and then they select another option

also about the code delete the point of the "PIGGY BACK" is to have functioning gauges and idiot lights so why would you want your CEL on all the time doesn't make sense to me but some people do things the round about way.



JBO since July 30, 2001