Finally have the car in the garage and the swap has begun.

For those of you unfamiliar, I bought a 1985 Cavy convertible last year from my sister. It has been in the family since about 1985, it has only 88,000 miles, has never seen snow, and is in amazing condition.

Apparently, the head had a crack in it when I bought it, which no one had diagnosed. So, after adding water all last summer until I couldn't drive it anymore, I took the leap and bought a new motor.

Out goes the 2.8 L iron head with 120 hp and in goes a 2006 LX9 3500 (3.5L) with 200+ hp. Coupled with the 4 speed manual transmission this car should really be impressive.

I will be posting pics with progress soon. I have the old motor out right now and am prepping the new motor and putting the performance clutch on.

Wow,
I'm really going to keep an eye on this, because I may consider doing something similar in the future.
Good luck and post everything you can about the swap !




~ Mike ~

Proves to be interesting the changes you will have to adapt and YOU are required to show lots of pics.Sounds like a pretty neat project and sure how it goes great.Look forward to seeing each step buddy.Cool

Why not go with a 5spd manual for the extra gas mileage, or won't the bellhousing line up?

I dunno if gas mileage is a consideration with a 3.5L , there Spike...LoL. I'd agree it prolly make for smoother going at cruizin' speeds tho. I'm betting that the 4 spd. might be a beefier unit , better to handle that extra torque. I'd imagine if you're willin' do do some "cut and paste" ie. ....torching out and welding in new motor mounts, that the sky is the limit to what you could shoehorn under those hoods. I'd be interested to know if anyone had dared a 240Hp Supercharged 3800 out of a Buick Riviera - sure sounds mean if nothing else :-)


.

Here is some background. The 3500 is from a Pontiac G6. It is a 60 degree v-6, which is the same basic motor as the 2.8, 3.1, and 3400. It is just a newer generation. Any tranny made for 2.8-3.1 will bolt right up. The reason i am using the 4 speed is cause that is what was already in the car. I did upgrade to a stage 3 clutch, since the stock clutch would not stand up to the added power and just end up slipping. I considered the 5 speed, but since it is not my daily driver, the MPG it saves would not be worth the changeover. And FYI, some have done this swap and MPG is even better. Mid 30's +. The motor breathes soooo much better and is more efficient.

As far as making it fit, the only thing I had to get was a custom front motor mount. I am using a 1990 wiring harness and computer from a cavalier. The only other thing I needed was an external crankshaft sensor which I ordered from WOT. I changed the sensors from the motor to those of the 1990 cavalier. The computer does not care what motor is running, as long as it has sensors it recognizes and the tune is adjusted for the differences in displacement. I had a custom chip made to run it.

As for pics, you can follow the swap thread on V6Z24 site... here is the link.

http://www.v6z24.com/jbodyforum/viewtopic,p,1296267.html#1296267

There have been some that have put the 3.8 supercharged in a cavalier. That motor is much more difficult to swap in however, as it is a 90degree v-6.

Stock, my car ran the 1/4 mile just above 16 seconds. After this swap, and if I can get traction, it should run about 14 second 1/4 mile, possibly high 13's. And run 0-60 about 6 seconds flat.

This will make one unique and interesting 1st gen. With 200 HP the convertible body will be shaking at the thought of a pedal to the floor! Keep us up to date as it looks like you are almost 1/2 way there with the swap.

Looks like you you've got a very easy "Plug n' Play" powerhouse there. That sure beats all the cutting and welding, not to mention a simple wiring solution - no small task!!
I can appreciate the fuel mileage/power combination, as I had a 97 Sunbird with the LD9 - for a short spell. I was impressed with it's fuel mileage on a gentle right foot, yet it had decent get up n' go when you found the floor with the gas pedal. The newer engines can be more efficient. I wasn't aware that GM used 4 spd trans-axles with any of the V-6's though.
We've got several members on here that have something similar that your doing on there wish lists!! We all appreciate you sharing your experiences with us!! :-) Keep us updated as you go along!!
I think, Ole Slick Vic just might still have a little edge on ya - at least till he runs outta fuel!! LOL

talk to the guys in the third gen forum here. they have some experience with the wiring. my brother just totaled a 98z with the 3500 swap. that thing could move. we used a early 90's 5 speed trans and custom mounts.

you will get better luck out of the 2nd gen guys on that swap 3rd gen guys have more electronics then what you need you should be able to run that off the 2.8L PCM with the crank trigger sensor mod. if its the VVT 3.5 you will lose that feature but then should have all working gauges if you swap pcms to keep that you may find yourself doing more wiring then its worth.

i wire my car every winter cause i change things here and there. like this year i removed EGR and installed an Intercooler installed a pump relay tired into the fuel pump circuit so the ic pump is only active when the car is fuelling. for your car wiring either way will be fiesable its just dependant on what your are invisioning but 2nd gen guys would be better to talk to



JBO since July 30, 2001

Between the guys on V6Z24 and 60*V-6 forums, I have plenty of those who are in the know. I am just posting here for an FYI to first gens owners what is possible. The motor will run just fine on the 1990 ECM, it is just a matter of switching all the sensors over to that year v-6. Oh, and filling the motor mounts with poly to make them solid, as it rips the stock mounts to shreds with the added power of the 3500.

As for the four speed, it was used on Cavaliers until 1986 I believe, before they went to the 5 speed. I think it is the same 4 speed used in the Fiero's as well.

The motor is non VVT as those are much more complicated to swap.

I was thinking of doing this swap into my Sunbird with the 3900 out of my 08 Uplander should some *unfortunate* incident happen...

I got distracted and never got back to the topic. You have my attention with the thread.

3900 swaps are more complicated. Depending on how much power you want, the 3500 can be built relatively easily. A cam, some headers, and porting and you can be pushing 250-275 HP at the wheels, which is somewhere close to 300 crank HP.

A member of V6Z24 swapped the 3500 stock, with log manifolds from a 3400 (somewhat restrictive) and a tune for a 3400 and his dyno numbers were just above 200 hp AT THE WHEELS. So the HP at the crank was around 225-230(figuring about 15% loss of HP between crank and wheels) He also smashed the heck out of his blower motor because running the 1/4 mile, the motor torqed so far back it hit the heater blower motor and the firewall. That is how he found out the hard way to fill the motor mounts with polyurethane

Wow...love the car.


I do have a question though-has the car been in MI it's whole life?


You guys are really making miss mine....


http://www.autotalk.com/pictures/data/1536/medium/2005_Chevrolet_Cavalier_Xtreme_002_autotalk_com_.jpg

If your doing all that work, why don't you drop a 5 speed hm282 in there and gain the extra gear?



On the inside my car looks like a fighter jet.

also with the 282 you can install a lsd which is simple and relatively cheap, they also have the jack shaft which i don't know if your 4 speed came with it or not.



On the inside my car looks like a fighter jet.

This car has been in Michigan most of its life, NEVER driven in winter. It spent 5 years in Florida with my parents in the 2000's. I really dont need the 5th gear, and I can always drop a 5 speed in later. But I drive it local only, so not too worried about top end. I do not have the jack-shaft and hope my axle shaft doesnt blow out, otherwise I will be swapping trannys soon. And from what I have seen, the LSD inserts are not cheap, but available for my 4 speed as well.

The way it stands, this swap is not as simple as I was led to believe. Hard, no, but a lot of minor fabrications, unseen details, and "oh @!#$" moments.

Hopefully motor goes in tonight. I don't plan on having it running for a while as I have to run new fuel lines, exhaust has to be tweaked, throttle cable brackets modified, and the always fun wiring harness installed.

Very cool...MI was very cruel to mine...


I wanna see this bad boy!


http://www.autotalk.com/pictures/data/1536/medium/2005_Chevrolet_Cavalier_Xtreme_002_autotalk_com_.jpg

Oh those "oh @!#$" moments" They are what makes it fun as long as your not trying to just get it done! I do have to say that I have the 5 Speed in my blue 84 convertible and it is a dream to drive compared to a 4 speed. Just like you said you can always drop in a 5 speed later on when you find one.

what an awesome thread, here and on the V6 board.

So...when you are done, interested in doing the same on my '86 Z hatch? Is the 3 speed auto beefy enough? How about the half shafts? A they say..a chain is only as strong as the weakes link....


(Quoting a past member)-"Never underestimate a First Gen"

Been Following your Z24 thread and was wondering how it is going? I am considering this for my brown 84 Cav Convertible. I was thinking of removing the transplanted 92 2.2L with auto trans and swapping in a 3500 with a 5spd. Or well if that is too complicated putting the 2.8 from the Cimarron in with a 5spd. I really do not car so much about pushing maximum HP out of this thing if the 3500 swap is really complicated and the 2.8 is pretty easy. Any thoughts from anyone who has done the swap.

Just an update.... there is nothing to update. Have been busy with other things, and the car is just sitting. I need to figure a few wire snafu's in the harness. It seems a few wires in the junction from the fuse block to the harness do not match up, so i will have to bypass and wire up somehow.

Hope to be working on it again soon.