First off let me start by saying I am NOT an engine builder! I do how ever want to know what is the difference between the 2.2 and the 2200 pistons, being run in a pre 1998 ln2.
I have searched and have been able too find anything from a 10.1 to 14.1 compression ratio and everything in between! Just look at this one tread... http://www.j-body.org/forums/read.php?f=2&i=421217&t=421217&p=2

So I decided that I would find out for myself what the difference really is...I was able to use this link for most all my info, http://www.automedia.com/Checking_Compression_Ratio/pht20020701cr/1

I took some pictures of the Two pistons side by side


This picture you can really see the difference in the dish of these Two pistons.



This show how much longer the skirt is on the 2200 piston , also I think it looks beefier.



Not sure how much you can see in this picture but the left is the 2200, right is 2.2. The 2200 is right at the top of the block where the 2.2 sits just below.




This shows the Two pistons at T.D.C. (as close as I could eye ball them) filled w/ fluid.

So this is what i came up with...
Bore = 3.5"
Stroke= 3.46"
cylinder head w/ a used gasket= 49cc
volume at T.D.C. = 2.2l 23cc
2200 8cc

If you take these numbers and use the web site linked above it comes out to be...

2.2 = 8.6 to 1
2200 = 10.86 to 1

so there you have it, a 2200 piston in a 2.2 ln2 is about a 11 to 1 compression ratio.

Some extra notes, I used a junk yard 1995 block and pistons and used pistons from a 2200.
I also used info from this post for my bore and stroke numbers...
http://www.j-body.org/forums/read.php?f=2&i=379668&t=379668#379668

so, if anyone wants to check my math or any calculations feel free.
I hope this helps someone out!

but actual comp ratio is i=higher than 10.86:1

and the 2200 has only a 6cc volume

compressed HG thickness is .042 for fel pro,
the only thing i am not sure of is actual head chamber cc's

From what I understand, These 2200 pistons are basically a drop-in for a 2.2?

I would like some more information on this...

You didn't calculate the compression height into the calculation, this will have an affect on the deck clearance. The '92-'97 2.2L has a compression height of 1.17" and the '98+ 2200 has a compression height of 1.2"

Mount each piston and rod assembly to the crank (w/ bearings) and use the TDC of each piston on the rod for the effective dome volume.

Quote:

Mount each piston and rod assembly to the crank (w/ bearings) and use the TDC of each piston on the rod for the effective dome volume.

This is how I did do it. The picture w/ the metal ruler shows both pistons @ T.D.C. (unless that's wrong). Fully bolted to the crank, w/ bearings.

Bob, There is I'm sure some +/- tolerances, I'm not a machine shop. Where do you think It should be if not around 10.86:1 ?
Also I used what I believe to be a factory block, never decked. I came up w/ 8cc making sure to fill around the rings as well as the dish.
Even if it is only 6cc than the c.r. would still only be 11.26:1, that's no were near 14:1

Mad jack, I'm not sure what should be done w/ the compression height? I looked at your links and see where it says that but not sure what that's for? Also did you look at the link I provided for checking the c.r.? They didn't mention this there.

thanks guys!

Listening.....

the pin height on the 2200 is lower tha the 2.2 therefore creating pop up effect, the only way to truly measure this is to get a positive stop and degree wheel and get it to true top dead center

i will do some figuring this week, static comp ratio with this setup should be 11.5-12.5 or a little higher

to mike yes this is a drop in for the ln2 motors

Chris, I was hoping that is what you did measuring the piston dish/dome cc.

The compression height is the distance from the wrist pin C/L to the deck of the piston. This will make a difference with the deck clearance to the block. You can also use it to figure the deck height or what zero deck would be. 1/2 stroke + rod length (C/L to C/L) + compression height + deck clearance = block deck height. i.e.: for my '96 LN2: (3.46 / 2 =) 1.730" + 5.589" + 1.17" + 0.021" = 8.510" deck height. to figure what zero deck would be just leave the deck clearance out of the equation, or 8.300". This doesn't bear a whole lot of relevance to the compression calculations as you have done them though.

Bob, when degreeing the cam I usually just get the angle of the crank at 0.050" down and split the difference, same result, different method.

Someone should dig through all the LN2 threads we've had throughout the last few years, and make a sticky. There is so much useful information in these LN2 threads but they all get lost over time.


2010 Honda Fit LX

So this is an OLD thread......i ran across this last week so what years makes and models did these pistons come out of ...is there anything else special that has to be used to use these in a 2001 2.2l OHV...like do i have to get bearings from an older car...gimme a rundown if anyone has any info on actually putting these pistons in a newer motor

There's no benefit for you to do this. The only benefit of swapping pistons around from the two different engines is to put the 2200 (1998 and newer engine) pistons in a 2.2(1997 and older) for increased compression. If you already have the 2200 engine, which you have because it's a 2001, you've already got the best you can have without buying new.


"In Oldskool we trust"

So the compression ratio would vary depending upon the head gasket and cylinder head thickness? Im kinda contemplating doing this to my 91. I either have a warped or cracked head, and I hate the auto/tbi anyway. Im either gonna do this or a 3400 I want to swap a 5 speed either way. We definitely need a sticky on this, maybe over in the racing section or here in Performance

Surface machining the surface of the block or zero decking the block (machining the block till the surface is even with the top of the piston), a thinner head gasket (stock is 0.055" thick), and machining the cylinder head gasket surface will all increase the compression. anything more than a 0.015" change will require the use of custom push rods and/or adjustable rocker arms. Each of these processes reduce the combustion space above the piston, hence increasing the compression. Zero decking the block is the fastest way to increase the compression without changing the pistons, next fastest way is using a thinner head gasket, finally machining the head.

Zero decking the block combined with the thinner Cometic 0.030" thick MLS head gasket (only available for '98+ 2200) and the head machined only enough to give it the proper surface texture and ensure it is straight, will give you approximately a 10:1 CR. You could also zero deck the block and surface the head approximately 0.030"-0.035" and use a stock replacement head gasket, which will also net you approximately 10:1 CR. The valve train on these motors is not adjustable, which is why you must use custom push rods and an adjustable rocker arm conversion to restore the proper geometry to the valve train, otherwise you will damage the motor. When machining the block and/or head this much, the machinist may warn you you are going to far, if they do, advise them you know that and the valve train will be adjusted to match.

To get a starting point on the push rod length needed, you need to start with the stock push rod length: '98-'02 is 7.518", '94-'97 is 7.457". Subtract the amount the block and/or the head were surfaced and the change in the heahead gasketickness.
i.e.:
7.518" ('98+ push rod)
-.026" (zero deck block)
-.025" (change in gasket thickness to a Cometic MLS)
-.010" (amount removed from the head)
=7.457" (new push rod length)

Seeing these calculations, you could actually use a '94-'97 stock push rod, so that could save you some shopping time. You would still need to verify the push rod length, as seen here. Note that the calculations will differ depending upon what changes will be made. Stock push rods may not always be advisable, if you use stronger valve springs, more lift and/or faster ramp rates on the cam. These may cause push rod deflection which could damage the valve train. With a mild cam, stock springs and stock rev limiter you should be fine with stock push rods.

This should be the least expensive method of increasing the CR. Most who do this type of mod would already be doing the rocker arm swap, so that wouldn't really be added into the cost, unless you didn't plan on doing that.

Hate to keep kicking this post up. But I was planning on doing this to a backup motor on a circle track car so I didn't have to do any expensive modifications to the head in order to gain the same (if not less) compression. When you change the rods, do you get bearings for the 2200 or the 2.2?

the rod bearings should be the same.. the mains are differnt

Alright. So I use the 2200 Rod, and 2200 Bearings and I have no modifictations that need to be done to my 2.2 block such as bore? Also, use torque settings for 2200 or 2.2?

they should be the same

Alright since no machine work is required and everything is the same. As in using 2200 bearings and the 2.2 block without machine work, I would suppose that would be the best way to go