1997 cavalier convertable 2.4l.
im about to build my engine up but havent a clue whats best for it or w.e.
i dont plan on boosting or anything like that in the near future.
im think about getting 2.3 cams. and maybe the 2.3 intake manifold. not sure whats the best size tb? what kinda pistons should i get? what are the differences in lower and higher compression ratios.-will they work better with the 2.3 swaps or should i keep the 2.4 stuff? what else would i need to get with the pistons-besides the rods and bearings? also plan on port and polish the head. any help is appreciated. thankx
ive heard boosting the 2.4 with the 2.3 cams isnt that great as leaving the 2.4 stuff in it-true/false?
already have intake, motor mounts, header, cat conv, cat 2.25, borla muffler and the b.m shiftplus if that helps.
The way you get more power is simple:
Increase the amount of air and fuel mixture in your cylinder with respect to the combustion chamber volume.
You can do this several ways; increase compression ratio by installing different pistons, installing a cylinder head with a smaller combustion chamber, decking your current cylinder head for a smaller combustion chamber, and boosting. Boosting essentially forces more air and fuel into the combustion chamber (hence the name "forced induction").
If you raise your compression ratio, and upgrade in your piston material, connecting rod, and crankshaft (forged, heat-treated, etc) is recommended.
Overboring and stroking out an engine is about the easiest way to gain displacement, which means more space for more air and fuel. "There's no replacement for displacement." Easiest way stroke our engines is use a 2.4 crank in a 2.3 yielding a 2.5 (and a 2.6 if you overbore to match the 2.4 bore size in the 2.3).
The 2.3 cylinder head on a 2.4 will yield a higher compression ratio, however you must do some mild machining to get the water jacket holes to line up properly.
Camshafts help you engine breathe. Higher lift means the valves open up more, allowing more air/fuel or exhaust to flow. Longer duration means the valves stay open longer. The key numbers you need to pay attention to is maximum lift, which will decide if you need to upgrade your springs and retainers, and duration at 0.05" lift which means pretty much how many degrees of crank rotation the valve stays open. Something else to pay attention to is your duration at 0.05" and your Lobe Separation Angle. Your LSA is the difference in degrees of rotation between your maximum lift for your intake and exhaust (which is mainly present on single-cam engines, but you can still combare the lobe angles for dual cams). Overlap can cause a slight degredation in performance. The scavenging effect of the exhaust system will suck out fresh air/fuel if both valves are open, which means you now have unused air/fuel in your exhaust.
Good machine work is essential to a decent engine build. Proper bearing undersize (on used cranks) is something you must pay attention to. A reputable machine shop will be able to help you determine the appropriate undersize, in addition to any overbore necessary on your cylinders. Don't bore out your block until you get your pistons in! All overbore pistons are not the same size. For instance, you order a set of 0.020" overbore pistons, which may range from 0.018 to 0.023, depending on the manufacturer's tolerances. The machine shop will be able to match an appropiate overbore per specific cylinder, which means a better fit, and less chance for blowby as you rack up the miles.
You can get your crank smoothed out some, I forget the different types of machine work to be done, but it essentially increases oil flow and reduced drag in the crankcase.
You will want to definately get a new oil pump, perhaps one without balance shafts even (they supposedly rob about 15 horses or so).
Porting and Polishing is only as good as the person doing it. If you want to do it right, get your intake and exhaust port-matched as well. A good flowing valve job is recommended as well (3 or 5 angle). It's easy to spend thousands of dollars in a cylinder head alone.
Power costs money, it's just a question of how much you want to spend.
do more research. and check out quad4forum.com faq
Working on obtainting an M-Class license... ?? Hint: 2 wheels.
Quote:
m about to build my engine up but havent a clue whats best for it or w.e.
than you shouldn't be doing ANYTHING to your engine. PERIOD. The 2.4 has been out for many years and many many people have modified it. There is a VAST amount of information easily found by LOOKING for it. No one can give you all the info you need by posting here, you need to spend A LOT of time researching on your own to be ready to build a motor for power. Its not as simple as slapping a bunch of parts together and getting a lot of power. Cams, portwork, valvetrain, compression ratio, etc, all need to be chosen in a way that they will compliment each other. In truth, you may not be ready to start buying parts for a long time if you are asking these types of questions.
Look on quad4 forums, do google searches on quad4/2.4 related topics, etc.
Establish a goal.... (ie: a desired 1/4 mile ET)
Figure out what you need to reach that goal (X-amount of power/X-vehicle weight)
Then start finding out what setup will reach that goal... Find other 2.4 owners who have done so and find out what they run, what has worked, and what hasn't. Understand how all the parts of the engine interract with each other, and understand how this interraction cam be improved for more power.
No one here has any problems answering questions, but saying "i'm a newb, what should i do?" is just plain lazy and makes everyone think you just want to be spoonfed everything you need. If thats the case, than you will never be successful in the performance realm. You have to be able to learn things yourself. If you need clarification in more detail of something, feel free to ask, but asking a totally uneducated and general question is asking for a post full of flames and no real help.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
well so far all of my answeres are being answered so i think i can start building it up. thankx for your help though. i know what a lil bout it, but thats what im asking if you read all my wuestions, i know about them all individually, but what compliments each other in the best overall way.
blink 777069 wrote:but what compliments each other in the best overall way.
I think Scarab hit the nail on the head. You asked a general question, I tried to educate you a bit with a general post. A lot of research is necessary for your level. And just like Scarab said, you must have an end goal. N/A, Forced Induction, and Nitrous should be your first question. This will decide what type of camshafts, valves, and pistons you should use. And then you just move from there... springs, retainers, lifters, connecting rods, crankshaft, bearings, intake and exhaust specifications (e.g. 4-1, 4-2-1 header, turbo manifold, or complete custom exhaust). The same goes with your intake, stock, HO, custom (velocity stacks + multiple throttle bodies, dual carbuerators) and also your fuel system (injector rating, stock computer versus MS, fuel rail size, fuel pump, etc).
There's a lot to making a modern engine run well. If you understand basic engine building concepts, it's not hard. But for someone who is just testing the waters, it's a lot of info to absorb at once.
What I suggest as a nice base reading point is reading up on GM's Ecotec buildup for different HP ratings, it gives you a general idea of the modifications necessary to achieve a direct goal (and all parts are available from GM).
^^ except he's got a 2.4
Quote:
well so far all of my answeres are being answered so i think i can start building it up. thankx for your help though. i know what a lil bout it, but thats what im asking if you read all my wuestions, i know about them all individually, but what compliments each other in the best overall way.
see, you just proved my point.... in the same sentence you say you're ready but at the same time prove that you aren't.... if you were "ready" you'd know what mods go well with each other on the 2.4... and AGAIN, if you ARE going to ask a question like this, we can't give you ANY answer without knowing what you want the car to do. Drag racing? Autocrossing? How fast do you want it to be? Once you figure that out you can determine how much power you need to get there and build accordlingly. My advice to you is seriously spend the next few weeks looking up old posts both here and the quad4 forums. Because believe me, if you're asking questions like this, you are nowhere near ready to build a performance motor.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
Scarab (Jersey Jay 1.8T) wrote:^^ except he's got a 2.4
It's still a good read if you don't know what kind of components an engine needs for different levels of performance.
again. i know about each component but not enough to know what works well with what. i dont have and end goal. it be alot simpler if you just answered the question instead of writing all this nonsense. all i really wanted was some definitions. not the most dificult thing to answer or do. and its not the hardest thing to comprehend if i had the answers like i asked so no i dont need to do any more research then ive already done. no autokross, just a fast overall motor. maybe for track-but doesnt have to be.
Allright, since you don't have an end goal.... how much money do you want to spend?
about 2000. this is not including the 2.3 swaps.
blink 777069 wrote:again. i know about each component but not enough to know what works well with what. i dont have and end goal. it be alot simpler if you just answered the question instead of writing all this nonsense. all i really wanted was some definitions. not the most dificult thing to answer or do. and its not the hardest thing to comprehend if i had the answers like i asked so no i dont need to do any more research then ive already done. no autokross, just a fast overall motor. maybe for track-but doesnt have to be.
how many times can you contradict yourself in one post? no one here can give you any information that will help because you're not giving us the information we need to help you... And its not nonsense, its called having a plan and knowing what you are doing before your start spending money. Building a motor that performs better than stock takes more than taking a few grand, buying parts and slapping them on. Since most places that sell pistons sell all compression ratios at the same price... your budget doesn't help to narrow things down. Beyond that 2000 probably won't get you far.
But since you're determined to be spoonfed, here's a few answers
The 2.4 needs more airflow, from ported head, and cams, and those alone will cost you $1500+, unless you can port the head yourself.
Higher compression will net you more power but isn't worth doing without headwork and cams. Also, the bottom end will need to be balanced and the cylinders honed. There goes at least another $500... and its pretty foolish to buy pistons and not invest in stronger lighter rods at the same time so there goes another $350/400... then bearings, any crank machining that may need to be done, etc. And thats still just for starters... on a total rebuild on a high mileage engine you'll need to replace all the seals as well as any of the other maintenance stuff like water pump, timing chain guides, etc.
Overall what i'm saying is building an N/A motor isn't for everyone. More gains can be had more easily with turbo, if the engine is tired, try finding a low mileage junkyard engine and a gm s/c or turbo.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
well how many times i gotta tell you? i already stated what i wanted to do. i already stated i dont need to know more that what i already know(or else theres no sense in asking anyone)
btw i can get a port and polished head for only 100. so that wont take much away from my 2000. again though the 2000 doesnt include the maony i already have for the 2.3 swaps listed above.
thankx for everyones help, especially for those who know what these boards are for.
