Just a question on swaping in these cams. I know that I will need the intake cam machined for the p/s and cam postion sensor and that I will need the cam towers (apparently just bolt up?) and 2.3 lifters, (anything else???) but my question is that with the increase in lift the cams provide would there be any clearance issues from the valves to the top of the piston??
thanks
Mark
there shouldnt be...the stcok w41 had 10: 1 pistons..and so do you i believe....might wanna recheck that one though....
but heres a question...are you planning on running these cams off your stock ecu?? and to be honest i believe some head work is in order...just my .02c though
I will be running them on a stock ecu but I will be also running e-manage.
As for the head, i am planning on a p&p, but I wanted to get cams organized prior to doing any head work.
Thanks for you comments!!
Mark
I run .410 lift cams with 10.5 compression flat top pistons with no valve pockets with .060 head gasket thickness and they dont hit.....
Awesome. As soon as you hit the rev limiter you start making awesome power. Not to mention your valve springs crying out in agony due to too much lift. Plus you still have the 2.4 oil pump which is terrible on high RPM oil PSI.
O noes!
what smokey said. The huge lift will require better valve springs, and the peak power of these cams is unusable with the stock rev limiter at 6250rpm. They scream after that, all the way up to about 7100...I think that is what the 2.3L limiter is...Karo, is that correct? You have to remember that Karo is running .410" lift cams, but he is also converted to OBDI, with the 2.3L chip installed to convert his rev limiter to 7100rpm so he can actually benefit from the power these cams will give you.
See
THIS THREAD for my post with more cam science.
-da chinchilla
<img src="http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/jiggamon/avatar15569_2.gif">
actually...the rev limiter on the w41 is close to 7500..and yes hes correct about your power band...these cams will make great power.....ABOVE your current limiter...if your going to be running w41 cams you need a w41 ecu (( or equivelant)) or your not gonna get much out of them..also the springs as mentioned they are correct.....
so what are you gonna do now? your gonna get your head port and polished and your gonna get some new springs....right after you locate a w41 ecu that you can wire in....correct me if im wrong, but will a 95 Jbody ecu fit the 96 + harness with out altering it???? if he could use that one,that ecu will take the manta chip...im not sure about it fitting though,i doubt it.
Not worth it until the HPtuners or similar software is released. This is on my list of things to do in the next few years as well. It would appear that you have all the physical requirements in order (other than the springs), but the stock ecu will neither accept these cams without throwing codes, nor allow you to benefit from them with the stock rev limiter.
15.3 @ 89.97mph, 14's on the way?
For Sale:
'01 SFGT springs $50CAN
Fidenza Flywheel '00-'02 2.4 (getrag) $300CAN
Getrag '00-'02 2.4 8000kms $800
Rev Limiter
91 W41 - 7400rpm
92 - 93 W41 - 7200rpm
Ho - 6800rpm
Bilmar - I heard 7600 but 7400 for sure
Manta - 7450rpm
Peak power
91-92 W41 - 190 hp@ 6800rpm
89-92 Ho - 180 hp@6200rpm
So you need the W41 chip or any way to modify the spark curves and fuel delivery.
You'll need to rewire the plug for the Ecm to fit a 95 Manual 2.3 ecm. So taht way you can buy a chip. you can go with an Scx or W41 442 ecm but you'll need to change the harness since the 2.4 ecm only has 2 plug if I'm right (don't quote me on that) and the W41 ecm have 3.
Running W41 cams without the chip? Impossible. A few tried the W41 cams with the Ho chip on the 2.3 and it doesn't work. W41 chip with Ho cams works tough.
Then I think we would see you in another post saying that you have a rough idle. W41 cams will give you a rough idle that will even stall sometime at the lights.
But why bother with all that? Just buy a set of JBP cams.
Gilles
2.3 Ho
Hmmm.....lots more stuff to consider than I orignally thought.
Thanks everyone for your replies and info. I gonna have to digest all this to see if I'm gonna do all this craziness or not.... Your probably right Mfk-233 and I should stick with JBP cams.
Thanks!!
Mark
96 2.4 ECM= 3 plug. 95 2.3 MT wiring harness=2 plug. I had a 95 wiring harness and ECM in my hand at one point, and was >> << that close to doing a 2.3 HO swap when I got a deal on a 2.4 turbo manifold.
Honestly, just do this: Get a 95 wiring harness, ECM, 2.3 HO chip, put better valve springs on the 2.4 head, and run 2.3 HO cams and towers. Grab the power steering pump off a 2.3, and do a little plumbing.
O noes!
Smokey , Thanks, I wasn't sure.
Gilles
2.3 Ho
HO cams will work with the stock ECU as long as you have the intake cam modified to accept the OBDII cam position sensor and have the hex drive for the power steering machined into the end.
protomec had done this. He has built 2 2.4L with the HO cams. One he did convert to OBDI (karo) and the other one was on a turbo 2.4L and the stock ECU. It did have fuel mods though of course.
Like said though, it is not worth it when you can simply get cams from JBP with aggressive specs.
-da chinchilla
<img src="http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/jiggamon/avatar15569_2.gif">
Still making the best power past the revlimiter. Screw the stock ECU, go with the OBD1 conversion.
GM cams have proven numbers and specs behind them. I am leary about the JBP cams. Who is running a set in their 2.4? Plus I could junkyard together a HO setup for the same price as the JBP cams.
O noes!
Oh, I completely agree Smokey, I just was saying that if you wanted to go cheap, you could just use the HO cams with the stock ECU...of course it is a waste since the power comes after redline.
Me, I am just looking for an LD2 intake cam.
-da chinchilla
<img src="http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/jiggamon/avatar15569_2.gif">
Smokey, you also have to remember about state inspection's. Being you have a 96, you might be alright, but In PA it is illegal to swap the computer from a different year car on 98 and newer. So my 99 would not pass because the emmissions are done via the OBD2 port, not the tailpipe.
I think the JBP stage 2 are a waste on a street driven car without a computer to take advantage of them
Jason
99 Z24
#25 to register on the Org !!
www.newdawncustoms.com
Johnny Mack Turbo Systems
Engineered Performance
Valid point. Because I live in Wisconsin, I don't care about SMOG tests or inspections
.
O noes!
