A short dieseling sound happened when I watched my wife drive off in her 2003 Sunfire today.
I have tried to research this, and some say lifters are not getting enough oil and some say the timing chain is going.

The car seems to run fine, but now when I heard this, I know it is not normal.

Has anyone else had this?

What was the cause of it for you?

Dieseling = engine running after spark has been stopped (doesn't happen on FI cars).

If you're talking about lifter noise, I suggest you switch to a 5w30 full synthetic and a high efficiency filter like PureOne or Mobil1 (NOT FRAM!). Nothing should be failing on an 03 Eco at this point in time.

2002 Cavalier 2200 5spd

Also, if the car is manual, the Getrag is infamous for its low RPM growl/clatter. If you overfill the transmission a bit, it goes away, but either way, the noise doesn't indicate any problem.

2002 Cavalier 2200 5spd

I had the car looked over today and the mechanic said there is a little metal dust in the oil, but that it is not much.
In other words, it is not great news, but 'can' be normal.

The next thing he noticed was there is lifter noise in cylinder 1.

He flushed the motor for 5 minutes, then poured in a bit of oil to chase the chemicals out.

I usually use 5w30, but he said that since it is hot out in AZ, that I should use the high mileage 10w30 because it has more detergents and helps get that metal dust from building up in the oil channels.

The sound is slightly less, but I know that at least one of my lifters is either needing an adjustment, ot replaced.

I called the dealership after I spoke to my mechanic friend and they said it would be $740 to do all 16 lifters.
I called Midas and they said they could pop the valve cover and adjust the one lifter for $160.
Dang it, I am not sure what route to take.

I know these 2.2s do not usually have issues this quick, but I added a 2 1/4 inch exhaust and cat along with a K&N filter and am wondering if it has pushed the engine a little too hard.

The mechanic I spoke to had an Alero with 240k miles and never had a motor related problem.

The problem is, I bought this car at 34k miles, and it now has 82k miles and it was a rental car.

People treat rentals like $hit.

I was also told my tranny mount needs replaced soon. !damn damn damn!

hey as far as the original problem i've never really heard of, but i read that the mechanic wants you to use 10w30??? no not in your motor. use the 5w30 but you can go synthetic. i use moble one and live in pheonix az. oh and i am a student at UTI and my instructors also have warned us about high milage oil, it has a posibility of making your piston rings swell, thus resulting in, yeah it seals your motor but your rings can wear even faster then before. but it is your choice. just some friendly advise


Silly ricer, useless wings are for penguins.

Quote:

hey as far as the original problem i've never really heard of, but i read that the mechanic wants you to use 10w30??? no not in your motor. use the 5w30 but you can go synthetic.

+1

Don't listen to jackass mechanics from the dark ages who think thicker oil is the answer to everything. Our motors were designed to run 5w30 from cradle to grave. Thicker oil may lead to starvation, especially in colder weather. Also, if you don't change your oil, make sure the people who do, don't dump in some one-viscosity-fits-all crap. They don't care how long your engine lasts.

2002 Cavalier 2200 5spd

^^ x3

Also, I'm pretty sure your car uses non adjustable hydraulic lifters, so I don't see how you can have them adjusted.

I run Castrol Sytec sae 5w40 (full synthetic), in my 2.4 in the summer time and havent ever had any problems.
I go back to 5x30 full synthetic of the same brand in the winter.

It's normal to hear some engine noise, and I highley doubt that if you have a lifter making a little noise that you can tell wich one it is just by listening to the engine. I would just drive it and not worry about it.

As far as the tranny mount goes... check it yourself first.

NEVER AUTOMATICLY BELIEVE ANYTHING A MECHANIC TELLS YOU WHEN IT COMES TO NEEDING THINGS REPLACED UNLESS YOU KNOW THE PERSON..

I fix everything myself unless I don't have the tools needed or if I just can't do it in the driveway. I've had oil change places tell me I need to replace things that are brand new on the car before. I was on the road when that happened... I normally change my own oil.

I'm a trained mechanic btw, and know when something is in need of replacement on my car, if only the shop trying to screw me over knew that.

X4

I listened to a mechanic with the 10x30
i ended up burning up my main bearings! cuz the heavier oil blew the seal off my oil filter! i drove 10 miles and GAHGAHGAHGAHGAH.. given it was a full throttle 10 mintues....

so dont listen to your "wise" mechanic.. stick with your 5w30 and you'll be okay
and try to fix the lifters yourself.. if you really want them done


"Z24 Dustbunny"

I called the dealership after I saw these follow-ups out of fear.

The mechanic there said that you can't swell the piston rings as they are metal.

He also said 10w30 is not thick enough to do anything damage wise.

He said the 5w30 is suggested as an overall choice of oil for the Ecotec due to the varying environments these cars are sold to, but it is an oil for colder environments and I am in Arizona. In Virginia during the winter, 5w30 all the way.

He did say that if I used straight 30 or 40 weight oil, then I would see some problems.
But in 80+ degree heat, 10w30 is still a very thin oil.

Everyone has been talking about the high mileage oil and saying how it is bad, but the funny thing I was pointed out by the dealership's mechanic is that the people who use it are usually trying to cure an ailing engine and then curse the oil for the failures that ensue shortly after and it was a pipe dream to think it was a cure.

That blue junk in a can that supposed to raise the compression is one of those pipe dreams. It will raise compression, but the engine running on uneven compression for so long will damage the engine and evening out the pressure across the cylinders is too late and failure will occur soon after.

When the seals become brittle, rings wear and valves do not seal as tightly is why the hydration of these items is beneficial. I doubt these seals will ever increase in size more than what they were new. It is like taking a mummy's finger and dipping it in hand lotion (bad example, but the point is there somewhere)

If they did grow larger than what they were new, I can fully agree that it would be out of spec and therefore cause problems rather than fix them. I just don't have a lab to check this, but just from replacing grommets and seals on other things when they age and become brittle, I just don't see an oil fattening it up past what it was when it was considered new. I could be wrong, but this mechanic knew I lived far from the dealership he works at and he wasn't trying to get me to come in at all. In other words, I doubt he thought some money could be had by lying.

I really do appreciate you guys telling me about the hydraulic lifters, that would have been a catastrophe there.
It sounds like Midas was fishing to get me in, pop open the valve cover then bend me over a post!

I was told that there is a chance I am hearing the tensioner make noises and not the lifter.
He agrees that 80k miles doesn't sound like the lifters would be culprit.
I cannot hear the sound straight on looking at the motor, just on the belt side side of the motor I can hear it.

I am also told the timing chain might be making the noise, where is the chain on the 2.2 Ecotec?

I read this about 10w30 vs 5w30:

5W30 versus 10W30
Virtually all new passenger vehicles sold in the U.S. use either 5W30 or 10W30 oil. The difference between the two is that the 5W30 flows better when cold, so if you live in a cold climate or operate your vehicle in a cold climate during the winter months, you should use 5W30 if it is the preferred oil for your vehicle. If you live in a sub-tropical climate and don't operate your vehicle in cold climates, then 10W30 is acceptable as long as the manufacturer specifies that it is permissible to use it.

Is there a disadvantage to using an oil that flows better when cold, i.e. 5W30 versus 10W30?
Sometimes, but usually not. The crux of the issue is this: the bigger the difference between the cold oil viscosity and the hot oil viscosity, the more the volume of viscosity modifiers and the less the volume of base stock. If you are good about following the manufacturer's recommended oil change interval then stick with the 5W30 if that is the preferred oil for your vehicle, even if 10W30 is acceptable in warmer climates. Older cars may specify 10W30 only. This is because they need a little more viscosity when cold to keep a protective film on the cylinder walls. There have been instances where the larger amount of viscosity modifiers that are present in 5W30 have broken down due to excessive heat and have left carbon deposits on the valves, but this is extremely rare. The proper fix would be to reduce the excessive heat, but the workaround was to use an oil with less viscosity modifiers.

I forgot to mention, 10 minutes at full throttle will kill just about any engine.
Were you fleeing for your life?

I reccommend you read some of the posts at www.bobistheoilguy.com. There is virtually no difference between 5-30 and 10-30 (actually, the viscosity "ranges" they use to classify the oil overlap somewhat, so you could have the exact same oil as a 10 and a 5). As for 10-30 blowing up your oil filter, the oil was not to blame. The 10 minutes of full throttle was.


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2000 Cavalier Coupe, 138k miles, 2.2 Auto, Silver (alive)
1999 Cavalier Sedan, 237k miles, 2.2 Auto, White (dead)

Crap... I ran the Sunbird I used to have at full throttle for just under a minute once (no speed limiter at the time), and the car took 10 minuts to idle right again once I got to where I was going.. although 120mph at full throttle in 4th gear is about 200rpm below redline so that prabably had more to do with it than anything.

To answer your question about the timing chain.. it should be behind the cover on the front of the engine (behind the belt and pullies). If it's anything like the 2.4, it's probably a pain to get to and labor intensive to have replaced.

To be honest... your car is prbably fine. Just because you hear a little noise desn't automatically mean something needs fixed. My thow out bearing has been rattling since I've owned my car, and I've never had any problems yet. Just a thought.

this chattering noise could be a number of things, i've been through this before. Could be lifters, timing chain, wrist pin in the connecting rod ect. Try putting some thick oil in it, hell, even some thick 20w won't hurt it. If the problem still persists then start thinking about replacing some motor parts.

Thanks for the input guys, I am going to try and degrease the motor and see if getting some of the sand and road dust out of the belt area helps as a first step.
The 10w30 seems to be working good so far on the motor.
I will keep the timing chain, and wrist pin in the connecting rod on my radar.
Hopefully the sound will go away or at least not get worse.