I figured Id post this in here instead of maintenence.. A few weeks ago I replaced my pcm and lsj injectors with an hpt tuned pcm from another 01 auto z and ford greentops. I also replaced the front o2 sensor because my old pcm had closed loop disabled so it kept blowing them.I even replaced it again to see if there was a problem. Well heres what happens:
A few minutes into driving the car will bog out lean unless I get over like 3k rpms but then it still tries to, and if I have to come to a stop the car will want to die unless I keep the rpms up. It will flutter from very lean where it wants to die for a few seconds, then bounce to 14-15's for a second then go lean again. Once I get driving and away from stops(highway cruisng) the car is fine and even when I get back to stops again it wont go lean except for maybe a second but it wont bog out and want to die. So basically it only does it a few minutes after driving and only lasts for a few minutes, after that its still a little more lean than Id like but still safe. It does it every time I shut the car off then drive again. At wot the car is pretty much ok, still a little more lean than Id like but safe. Idle at startup is much leaner than Id like as well, and it will sometimes go all the way lean but wont realy bog out.
What does this sound like? Clogged injector maybe or something in the tune? There was no ve tuning done with the pcm and the car it came from was running more boost on a bigger turbo than I was, mostly just trans/misc settings and the injector constant put in for the 440's. I understand that every car should be tuned for its specific setup but I dont think it would cause this.
Any help is greatly appreciated!!
first, bogging is being drowned in fuel.. so if you're running lean, its not bogging..
secondly, LSJ injectors are not 440cc they're 330 or something like that (i forget the actual size at the moment) but they're a lot smaller than 440cc, which is probably why your car is acting so strangely.. the injector constant is way off
icemike89 wrote: A few weeks ago I replaced my pcm and lsj injectors with an hpt tuned pcm from another 01 auto z and ford greentops.
I had lsj 378cc injectors, I now have ford greentops which are 440cc's.
And sorry I guess I shouldnt have used the word "bogging", I could have said cutting out from not getting enough fuel.
I took that quote as you saying you replaced your lsj injectors, and put on a pcm from a car that had ford greentops. Misread on my part.
are the 440s new? whats your injector constant?
anyway I can get a look at your HPT tune?
No the 440's arent new but I believe only have a few thousand miles on them. Not sure what the injsector constant is for the 440's and dont have the file for the tune as I didnt do it. I can get it though, I got them from Dragracemyz24 who I got many of my turbo setup parts from. He said it idled fine and was never lean, leanest wot he saw was like 11.8 and that was when he upped boost to 12psi on a to4e .63ar
Its been doing this since I first put the injectors/pcm in which is what made me think clogged injector, unless the rest of my fuel system cant keep up. Ill see if I can get the file from him or maybe he'll chime in.
Hey PJ I have his tune . I would love to post everything up how do I do that to here???
Well lets see here your injector constant was figured based on shifted's formula. 0.32359 is the injector constant for the reflashed 310cc injectors.
you take .32359 X ( 310cc / 440 cc ) = 0.22798 I did the formula correctly since I just checked your scan and I have 0.22746 . I think I changed the last two decimals to smooth out the idle a little bit and it worked. As stated before every car is a little different. But the formula was done properly as you can see from here....
4 cylindertuner.com
Windy City TurboZ
Here is a complete history of everything done to Mike's particular computer that I sent him. I don't know if this will help and if any changes need to be made I can do so with no problem.
Sun, Apr 27 2008 -
Transmission
Auto Shift Properties
Shift Pressure
Base Shift Pressure vs. Torque vs. Gear - Normal
Sat, Apr 26 2008 -
Engine
Torque Management
General
Traction Control System
TCS High RPM/VSS Enable Speed changed from 106 to 150 mph
TCS High RPM/VSS Disable Speed changed from 103 to 143 mph
TCS High RPM/VSS Enable RPM changed from 6500 to 7000 rpm
TCS High RPM/VSS Disable RPM changed from 6200 to 6700 rpm
Transmission
Auto Shift Properties
Shift Pressure
Base Shift Pressure vs. Torque vs. Gear - Normal
Torque Management
Abuse Mode
Abuse Mode Master Enable switched to Disabled
System
Fans
General
First Stage Fan Turn On Temp changed from 218 to 212 °F
First Stage Fan Turn Off Temp changed from 212 to 206 °F
Speedometer
Speed Limiter
General
Speed Limit 2
Sun, Apr 20 2008 -
Engine
Torque Management
General
Maximum Torque
Max Torque vs. Gear
Transmission
Torque Management
Abuse Mode
Abuse Mode Master Enable switched to Enabled
Torque Reduction
Torque Reduction vs. Torque vs. Shift - Normal
Wed, Apr 16 2008 -
Engine
Fuel Control
Fuel Cutoff, DFCO
RPM Limits
Fuel Cutoff RPM
Fuel Resume RPM
Fuel Resume RPM - excessive
System
Fans
General
First Stage Fan Turn On Temp changed from 223 to 218 °F
First Stage Fan Turn Off Temp changed from 218 to 212 °F
Mon, Apr 7 2008 -
Engine
Fuel Control
General Fuel
Injector Control
Injector Constant changed from 0.25250 to 0.22746
Torque Management
General
Maximum Torque
Max Torque vs. Gear
Transmission
Torque Management
Abuse Mode
Abuse Mode Master Enable switched to Disabled
Thu, Apr 3 2008 -
Engine
Idle
Idle RPM
Idle RPM
Target Idle Speed vs. Coolant Temp
Fuel Control
General Fuel
Injector Control
Injector Constant changed from 0.22746 to 0.25250
Torque Management
General
Maximum Torque
Max Torque vs. Gear
Transmission
Torque Management
Abuse Mode
Abuse Mode Master Enable switched to Enabled
Sun, Mar 30 2008 -
Engine
Fuel Control
General Fuel
Injector Control
Injector Constant changed from 0.11574 to 0.22746
Sat, Mar 29 2008 -
Engine
Idle
Idle RPM
Idle RPM
Target Idle Speed vs. Coolant Temp
Fuel Control
General Fuel
Injector Control
Injector Constant changed from 0.22746 to 0.11574
Wed, Mar 26 2008 -
Engine
Idle
Idle RPM
Idle RPM
Target Idle Speed vs. Coolant Temp
Fuel Control
General Fuel
Injector Control
Injector Constant changed from 0.32359 to 0.22746
Torque Management
General
Maximum Torque
Max Torque vs. Gear
Transmission
Torque Management
Abuse Mode
Abuse Mode Master Enable switched to Disabled
Torque Reduction
Torque Reduction vs. Torque vs. Shift - Normal
Speedometer
Speed Limiter
General
Speed Limit - Fuel Cut
Windy City TurboZ
Thanks Luke. PJ let us know if that file works for ya.
I can't wait until it doesn't run like poop anymore. I so call a ride in that beast once the problem has been corrected
. btw... since I have a BRAND SPANKIN NEW motor.... forged bottom and boost has been itchin at me lol. I can never make up my mind.
"still want to smash that like the fist of an angry god"
restore your low rpm coastdown tables back to stop look wayyyyyyyy to lean bro. Also what is your fuel pressure at?
Looks like Im gona have to take a little trip to get some tuning done. But...tax returns are coming
Is there any way I can test the injectors to see if your working properly? Or is there any way to clean the fuel system properly myself or do I have to have to take the injectors somewhere to test/clean them?
LOW RPM COASTDOWN. It's under your engine's Min VE under the Airflow tab.
place in the stock values and adjust from there.
Oh no my bad man, grammar error lol was misunderstood when you typed stock. so you think its in the tune then? could that be causing it to go lean the way it is for that period of time?
I just checked out your tables and they are extremely low.
lol if you never did any ve tuning then that motor doesn't have long to live.... and you had to touch those tables those aren't stock at all....
wait wtf your telling me this is all "mail order" tuning?
ice mike, find an hptuner local bro,....
also to above poster, you need to modify the ve tables for a clean accurate tune as well as you need to tune the pcm while in the vehicle. Also those tables were altered who cares if you or Santa Claus did it, I said it wasn't a stock table and you said it was a gm reflashed pcm so that answers that now don't cry.
Its cool Luke, I think Ima take a trip to PA got someone with unlimited 01 credits. Yes I know the wise thing is to actual tune in the car but with similar setups and no ve tuning done it should be fine. Hopefully a decent street tune will fix this problem and its not something with the fuel system.
Quick description of whats happening. Im setting up a time soon to get it checked out with hpt and do some tuning, but just wondering if anyone has any input on what this sounds like.
It will sputter if I come to a stop after a few minutes of driving, then will get better after a few minutes but not completely. When it first starts to happen if I come to a stop the car will go lean and die unless I keep the rpm's up a bit and even then it still tries to. Mostly low end and idle problems,it bounces around a little while cruising from sometimes from high 13's to mid 16's, but mostly high 14's to mid 15's so Id like to check that out and try to smooth it out see if we can get a somewhat steady 14.7 or so.
Say if I start driving, about 1-2 mins into driving it will start going lean and sputtering but it bounces to like 13's then will go lean and sputter, rapidly back and forth. Then when I get to highway driving it will do as I just described, but wont sputter or try to cut out. Then when I get back to stop and go driving from the highway, its still a little lean and bounces around but doesnt try ot die anymore. It still sputters a little but only for a second when leaving a stop and doesnt try to die.
Now i don't know much about tuning a j-body yet but like other said it might be the tune. But this might be something to check that i have noticed with mine. I have a lc-1 installed in my 2.4 sunfire after i put the header on and ho manifold. Any way i had a vaccum leak at the injectors (o-ring was in the hole all the way). Well i couldn't figure it out at first. I never had a high idle or anything and would drive fine sometime and others not but when i came to a stop the wideband would shoot up to like 17.1 and start to stumble. Did it for about a day till i took starter fluild to everything by the manifold and found it.
Now at the collector on my header i have a exhuast leak, but goes away sometimes depending on how much the motor moves sealing itself. Well it is doing the exact same thing you are describing because the o2 for the motor and the wideband see's is lean so it starts dumping alot of fuel in at a idle till it starts stumbling and goes crazy when it starts that. So you might have a exhaust leak somewhere maybe.
Also i figure you have a eco if not this might not apply but a guy i work with has a 04 cavalier that is mainly stock cept muffler but is decked out on the outside. And it well set at a idle and idle up and down and start running real rich. Well i seen the check engine light was on and asked him what was wrong with it and he said it was the ait sensor causing it. If it was or not i'm not sure but maybe your sensor is going bad because them temps do seem high for being colder weather out.
Any way i thought i would try to help and if doesn't then o well but good luck figuring it out.
