Anyone here running a 16 volt system? I'm half tempted to do one to feed my amps.
whats the advantages?
I may run 18s, but I can do your taxes in 10 seconds flat.
^^^ are you serious?
more voltage = more power = more output from your amps
more voltage doesnt mean more amperage....and amps are what give you more output....you can up the amperage without upping the voltage....
I may run 18s, but I can do your taxes in 10 seconds flat.
^^^ WTF are you ralking about?? He is saying that if you feed an amp more voltage the amp will produce more rms watts....amperage is differnt....and yes if you look at most amp test sheets they are at 14.4v so it makes more power...do it by the new test sheets they are tested at 12.6 volts and make less power...phil
Well, most new amps are rated at 14.4 volts, which is a good healthy system with your engine running. Once the bass hits, you're dropping voltage, which in turn drops your wattage. Most amps don't benefit from anything over 14.4 volts because they have a regulated power supply. Once you start hitting bona fide competition amps, then you open up a whole new can of worms, because you can feed them 18 volts which is what a 16 volt system is. If you up the voltage and the amperage stays the same, more power. Upping the voltage doesn't necessarily mean more amperage draw.
For example:
My two MA audio HK amps are rated at 14.4 volts
12 volt - 1500 watts rms
14.4 volt - 1800 watts rms
18 volts - 2250 watts rms
That's all at the same amperage draw.
Another analogy----
Those of you who do house wiring should know this. Some devices can be run 110 and 220, such as compressors and such. I'll use a compressor for example. At 110, the compressor draws 15 amps. At 220 volts, the same compressor draws 7.5 amps. Double the voltage, half the amperage. Watts = amperage draw X voltage. Less amps = less heat = smaller wire.
see i did not know that amps could handle more than 14.4.....thank you
I may run 18s, but I can do your taxes in 10 seconds flat.
Your biggest problem will be keeping your 16V system charged if you use it for a daily-driver.
I'm not sure it's as simple as using a 2nd, completely separate, 16V alternator on a 16V battery setup, but maybe it is. Have one 12V alt running the car, and a 16V alt charging your batts in the back. I'm not sure on that one.
But you hit the nail on the head -> watts=amps x voltage. It takes alot more current draw (amps) to produce a certain wattage at lower voltage than at higher voltage. Current draw causes heat, so the only way some amps can make big power (without burning up) is to supply them with high voltages. My American Bass VFL150.1s are no different than those MA amps. On a 12V system I can't go below 0.5 ohms for daily driving without fear of the magic smoke. But at 18V, they'll burp no problem at 0.125 ohms (or even lower), and make monster power doing so.
Are you planning this for a daily driver, or comp-only setup?
J.J. Lecznar wrote:... bring ur @!#$ over here and i wil blow what u have to hell.... ill put @!#$in 200 dollars on it...
*wipes tears from eyes*
Daily driver brother
I'm thinking about going with a 16 volt alternator, 16 volt batteries, and a jacobs accuvolt.
youd have to do a dedicated volt for the beat. your normal electronics wont be able to take it. Bcm go poof!
So that would mean a separate alternator+regulator, and battery and wiring for 18v. Has anyone even put dual alts in their cavy?
Not necessarily. You *could* do it two different ways. Either a step-down transformer, or a step-up transformer. If I run an accuvolt, I can drop it from 18 volt down to 14.4 to feed the regular electronics.
Skyler Prahl wrote:So that would mean a separate alternator+regulator, and battery and wiring for 18v. Has anyone even put dual alts in their cavy?
i have them sitting here waiting on me to decide whether or not im going to bother with the hassle or not. you could take your ac compressor out nad fab a bracket in place of it. lots of ways to do it.
i would just go with a step up transformer. you can mount it in the back right before the amp, or mount it under the hood of the car. there should be less voltage drops running a higher voltage a longer distance rather than a smaller voltage a shorter distance. now its only an extra 4-6V that will be carried on the wire and its only like 18 ft of wire, so the voltage drops will probably be negligable anyways.
the step up transformer will be the cheapest, least chaotic way to do this. mounting second alternator will be more of a pain in the ass then its worth, plus you will loose your a/c if equiped to even be able to install it in a good location.
now installing it in the stock alternator spot would be a slightly better idea. you can run the amp right off of it, but you will have to step down EVERYTHING ELSE, which would be harder than stepping up just the amplifier.
so if your going to do this i think that would be the best way, to step up at the amplifier. but lets face it, the probability of you actually doing this is probably not even worth the amount of posts that we have all put up.
im not trying to be a jerk, but i highly doubt you will be upping up to a 16 or 18V system. what you could do is get 2 batteries in the trunk in series and bring it up to a 24V system, but i dont know how your going to charge those.
anyways, have fun.
Injection is nice but id rather be BLOWN!
This is what we had a discusion about in mobile class.... Running a 18V system. 3-6v batts in trunk in series. Take the first two and run your 12v's off that, than the 3rd battery for your 18v's to the amp. Now to charge this... A diode has about 0.6v-0.7v drop across it so if you put like Six of them on your voltage regulator wire for the amp, it would read about 4v lower that it is. So it would run at 18v to charge the battery bank.
I'm sure there is much planning for this to work, but the real question is will it?
sure that would work......but a properly sized resistor would be cheaper.....just make sure to get one with the proper wattage rating or you'll smoke it. one large wattage resistor would be cheaper than multiple large wattage diodes.
oh and just FYI transformer is the wrong term....DC power is unaffected by induction which is how a transformer works. to DC power, a transformer is looked at as an open circuit and no current will pass.....to decrease or increase dc power you need either a voltage divider network, or simply dropping resistors, and to increase dc power you need a voltage multiplier, which utilizes capacitors and resistors in a network to up the DC voltage. a transformer is useless in DC
You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan
(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)
Rich Smith wrote:This is what we had a discusion about in mobile class.... Running a 18V system. 3-6v batts in trunk in series. Take the first two and run your 12v's off that, than the 3rd battery for your 18v's to the amp. Now to charge this... A diode has about 0.6v-0.7v drop across it so if you put like Six of them on your voltage regulator wire for the amp, it would read about 4v lower that it is. So it would run at 18v to charge the battery bank.
I'm sure there is much planning for this to work, but the real question is will it?
Show me a diode that'll handle around 250 amps of current draw
whitegoose wrote:i would just go with a step up transformer. you can mount it in the back right before the amp, or mount it under the hood of the car. there should be less voltage drops running a higher voltage a longer distance rather than a smaller voltage a shorter distance. now its only an extra 4-6V that will be carried on the wire and its only like 18 ft of wire, so the voltage drops will probably be negligable anyways.
the step up transformer will be the cheapest, least chaotic way to do this. mounting second alternator will be more of a pain in the ass then its worth, plus you will loose your a/c if equiped to even be able to install it in a good location.
now installing it in the stock alternator spot would be a slightly better idea. you can run the amp right off of it, but you will have to step down EVERYTHING ELSE, which would be harder than stepping up just the amplifier.
so if your going to do this i think that would be the best way, to step up at the amplifier. but lets face it, the probability of you actually doing this is probably not even worth the amount of posts that we have all put up.
im not trying to be a jerk, but i highly doubt you will be upping up to a 16 or 18V system. what you could do is get 2 batteries in the trunk in series and bring it up to a 24V system, but i dont know how your going to charge those.
anyways, have fun.
Once again, show me a step up transformer that'll handle the current draw. Not going to happen. It'll be a lot easier to step down 50ish amps worth of electronics. And that's just what the Jacobs Accuvolt will handle
Also, not to be a jerk, but unless you know what you're talking about, don't bring anything to the plate. They do make 16 volt batteries for 16 volt systems (who knew?!?!) so everything matches up.
Lanman31337 wrote:
Show me a diode that'll handle around 250 amps of current draw
http://www.surplussales.com/Semiconductors/Diodes-3.html
ok ok, so its only 240 amps but you get the idea
anywho.....i'll look through my books and notes and see if I can't figure out a system that will do what you need, and not contain a rediculous amount of parts. check back tommorrow and i may have an answer
edit: ok, i had a major brain fart.....forgot that a voltage multiplier is an ac concept......hmm that changes things a bit....but i'll try to come up with something that should work
Edited 2 time(s). Last edited Monday, October 02, 2006 8:02 PM
You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan
(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)
Just so I'm understanding correctly, you're wanting to run 16v all the time. So driving down the road you need to be putting that many volts out.
Hmm..I'll have to think about this one. I did run a 16v alternator in my Cav, but had an adjustable regulator so that I could turn it down while driving around town, then when at shows I just cranked it up. Worked pretty well, and strange or not, the 16v didn't kill my electrical system. (Not that this bit of info helps you much, but I thought I'd throw it out there.)
I think so more on it and get back to you.
Mike Roth
Man I shouldn't type when I'm this tired. That should say, "I'll think some more on it and get back to you".
Mike Roth
I think there's a way to do it without running multiple alternators. Mike - I have 2 amps that'll take 16+ volts like a champ and give me around 300 watts rms each with 17 volts.
whitegoose = big tool
kinda kicking myself in the ass now.
i guess your only options are to run multiple batteris or to run a 16V alternator. personally i would lesn to wards the multiple batterries as it would probably be more cost effective.
Injection is nice but id rather be BLOWN!
Definitely going to be cost effective to run 16 volt alternator and 16 volt batteries, and a step-down unit. We'll see what Mike and Rich has to say.
whitegoose - I don't mean to pick on you, not at all, but this isn't your normal everyday setup, and yes, i'm going to be running it. If I wasn't, I wouldn't ask.
Rich - I'm still going to need a diode that'll handle a heavy current draw, wouldn't I?
In theory, not w/ my set up. just a few $.20 silicon diodes from radio shack. hooked to voltage sense wire, not the main alternator wire.
I have seen three post car audio batteries 12v-16v for mega bucks, over $1000. Also you can get a race car battery 3 post, the third post was for 16v to the starter. You could use one on these, but I don't know what amperage this would be able to sustain? Both batteries have what would be need available to charge them w/ a 14.4v alternator.
