Alright, as some may know i am dumped on some Tein SS. Now I noticed this immediately after lowering the car but was hoping it was my alignment having a toe battle.
Anyway, the problem is, anytime I accelerate I get this shaking/shuttering in the front end. Feels almost like a side to side movement. This happens at any percentage of throttle, more throttle makes it more noticeable.
First thing I noticed was a tear in the driver side outter axle boot while aligning the car, to which I thought I found the problem. However once I replaced both axles the same problem still occurs..
So now at that point I was thinking is this something that could be cause by being too low? Some sort of axle binding because the joints are at more of a angle now? Raised the car up a little bit.. I'm talking like 3/4 of a inch. Still does it somewhat but hard to tell if it really lessened but feels like it did. So, I mean that is a pretty good indication it is from being too low but the more I think about it the more I wonder.. could it be something else other then the axles?

So my thought is, to open discussion on this because:
1 - I know there are those lower then me and I have not heard of them having any issues
2 - I know there are some wanting to be similar to the height i showed so trying to figure out the problem here now before more get to it
3 - I really like my car being so low and would rather find out it is something else

Things to know is this is a 04 Cavalier, Automatic, with 64k on it. Running factory 95-99 Z24 wheels with 205/55/16. Everything is stock on it except for the Tein SS, Vibrant strut bars, eibach rear sway bar
Things I was trying to consider, could this be from sloppy control arm bushings? Maybe they worked fine with stock suspension but once lowering it did I trash them? Tie rod ends or ball joints maybe? Both looked fine but did no actual testing on these.

So just want to open the discussion to open some ideas.. anyone else having similar issues? Plan is to raise the car up about another 1/2" this weekend but want to brain storm now and maybe find something else to look at while messing with it.

Mine does this if i have it too low and moderate/hard accelerate.

I have an '00 cavalier on Tein S-techs with stock struts, stock FE2 sway bar, front/rear strut bars, and all front RKSport rubbers. Had this setup for around 2 years. My car rides like ass because my stock struts are blown and my mounts are all bad, but other than that I have no problems... aside from going up my driveway and speed bumps. However, I'm assuming by TEIN SS you mean the Super Street adjustable coilovers. The problem is, is that once you dumb it your whole suspension geometry gets thrown off. You have to upgrade everything to handle the extra strain being put on the rest of your system. Your just naturally going to wear down tie rods, ball joints, bushings, etc on a more regular basis than someone with stock suspension or a mild lowering spring/strut combo. There is a reason lots of people change their suspension setup at the track and change back for the ride home, that and if you like to play with toe it will wear your tires down nasty.


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Take a look when the car is lowered and see what angle the axles are at. If they have to much of an angle they will do all sorts of funny junk. Similar to angles with u-joints on driveshafts on raised trucks. This is where a spindle that has a raised bearing section would be wonderful for dropped applications so it would allow better axle alignment when lowered.

black sunshine wrote:Take a look when the car is lowered and see what angle the axles are at. If they have to much of an angle they will do all sorts of funny junk. Similar to angles with u-joints on driveshafts on raised trucks. This is where a spindle that has a raised bearing section would be wonderful for dropped applications so it would allow better axle alignment when lowered.

yeah i understand the concept of the axles being at a extended angle. im hoping to hear some suggestions of what else could be the culprit here as well..say, the reason my axles are binding is due to bad control arm bushings etc.. not just saying the problem is your axles. and maybe hear a little bit of talk towards what we could possibly do to fix this.. I doubt anyone makes anything near raised bearings.

Raise the car some and see how it does. If that doesn't do it then start inspecting suspension components.

Axle geometry is normally the cause of this kind of shuttering on a lowered car.


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Mines been shaking since I lowered it. Im not even that low. I figured it was just since I havent gotten an alignment but if someone else is having problems with it, I might have to look into this shaking.

Weird thing is that before I lowered it I had a vibration at about 80 mph and now thats gone but its shudders and shakes taking off quite a bit,

Get your alignment and your wheels rebalanced.


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Im not wearing my tires weird so Ive been putting it off. Just gonna replace my ball joints and tie rods since theyre starting to go then get an alignment. We'll see where it goes from there.

OP's problem is axles having too much angle, either switch to axles with tripods instead of CV's or raise the car.

sundown, get an alignment.


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Club Teh Jeffie wrote:Raise the car some and see how it does. If that doesn't do it then start inspecting suspension components.

Axle geometry is normally the cause of this kind of shuttering on a lowered car.

yeah planning on raising it

Leafy wrote:OP's problem is axles having too much angle, either switch to axles with tripods instead of CV's or raise the car.

Do they even make tripods for our cars? Kind of curious to see that they would make a difference

Sure thy make tripods. You take your axles to a drive train shop and tell them to
make them for you. Its not hard, tripod ends with the right splines and the right length shaft.


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I think you have some kind of problem i would look at your control arm bushings as a start. I'm running a very close setup to you except I have rims and tires at 215/45/17 and i have no problems. i'm also running my Teins low control arms parallel up front and 2 threads left in back. I've had it like that for about 5k miles so far have gone to the track DD it everything and it rides smooth except for bumpy roads and speed bumps of course. Accelerates great too no pulls or vibes. Either you really are to low not sure where your ride height is at up front or something is worn out.

RED wrote:I think you have some kind of problem i would look at your control arm bushings as a start. I'm running a very close setup to you except I have rims and tires at 215/45/17 and i have no problems. i'm also running my Teins low control arms parallel up front and 2 threads left in back. I've had it like that for about 5k miles so far have gone to the track DD it everything and it rides smooth except for bumpy roads and speed bumps of course. Accelerates great too no pulls or vibes. Either you really are to low not sure where your ride height is at up front or something is worn out.

the difference there is your control arms are parallel.. mine are definitely not.. barely had a finger gap between tire and fender.. so like everyone has said, including myself, that is where i am starting obviously.. just wanted to open discussion. some nice prothane control arm bushings couldnt hurt though.

Leafy wrote:Sure thy make tripods. You take your axles to a drive train shop and tell them to
make them for you. Its not hard, tripod ends with the right splines and the right length shaft.

i know the inner joints are tripod.. i can just turn the axles around right
are tripod axles going to resolve this though? curious because i would still imagine the tripod being at the same angle obviously, i understand a tripod has some in and out movement so i could see where it would be able to extend to compensate for the longer length needed for the angle, but would it still bind and cause the shaking? In my mind I am using a universal joint socket as a example, the point your at too much of a angle so when you rotate to a certain point it has to straighten out a little more to make up for the lack of movement at certain angles, if that makes sense

My teins are dumped and I have no such issues, the car handles well and does not vibrate. The passenger axle did start to make a really horrid metal on metal noise and the drivers side ripped a boot.

Stephen (manta z) wrote:

Club Teh Jeffie wrote:Raise the car some and see how it does. If that doesn't do it then start inspecting suspension components.

Axle geometry is normally the cause of this kind of shuttering on a lowered car.

yeah planning on raising it

Leafy wrote:OP's problem is axles having too much angle, either switch to axles with tripods instead of CV's or raise the car.

Do they even make tripods for our cars? Kind of curious to see that they would make a difference

i don't think it is to much angle. its not like you lifted the car and have a 45 degree angle on the axles. your control arm should be level to the ground wth maybe a hair of up angle. the problem that i think is happening is the axles are bottoming out in the inner cup and don't have travel to move in. don't forget the drivetrain setup was designed to operiate at about a 30 degree negative angle toward the ground, not a even or possitive angle away from the ground.

my car had no fender gap and i never had a problem, but i do remember with my brothers sunfire back in the day was driving around pretty much dumped all the way and had some of those strange issues...



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You said it felt like a side to side movement?....I'd check the bolts for the lowwer control arm and see if they are loose.....I had a problem with pulling side to side when my front control arm bolt broke lucky for me my lower engine mount kept the bolt from coming all the way out until I pulled the car apart and fixed it.

I also have a small amount of vibration since the motor/tranny swap(under acceleration). Naturally the front sits a little lower than it did before, and it gave my axles more angle than they already had. I've already come to the conclusion that the axle angle is the reason for this. (Eibach sportlines on Tokiko D-specs),

So what did it end up being?....any updates?

yeah sorry, been so busy with work and events I've just had to deal with it and drive it. I have a photo shoot to do today but i'm going to try to raise it up more right now before I have to head to that.

raised it up a little more today and it still does it. I looked over the ball joints, tie rod ends, and control arms the best i could and didn't find anything odd.
so i think i need to be looking elsewhere and the only thing that makes sense to me is control arm bushings, or some sort of motor/tranny mount. any suggestions? I know axles is the text book most common answer to this problem, and thats what i've heard a lot but i just like to question it because i just have a feeling its something else.
anyone got a set of stock control arms i can put some prothane bushings in and see what happens lol

some photos below. you can see i raised it about another 1/2", you can see where the threads are cleaner where they used to be. then the one photo is showing how high the front end is now.



two photos before raising it, it just doesn't seem that low to me that the axles would be the problem.



after looking at the photos it doesn't really look like it raised it that much but still compared to others and my past js, they haven been that low and it wasn't a problem.


Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Sunday, June 19, 2011 11:32 AM

i think i still have my stock control arms w/ prothane bushings.


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Just wanna say when I had air on my yellow cav when I was to low it did the same thing. Reason I didn't care was because I could just lift it whenever so I never looked into it.

after looking at the pictures it looks like i may have only raised the car up a 1/4" so this weekend i'm going to try to go up a bit more, need to raise the rear up too. i just want this @!#$ to be low but i guess i'm just screwed in that..

Leafy, your idea intrigued me, so your thinking if one were to have custom half shafts made with tripods on inner and outter joints will eliminate this problem? what about causing another problem? I know of a place that makes custom driveline components through my work so I may bring it up to them if this is something you've looked into?