my RK sport kit is eurathane as most are... what has to be done for proper adhesion of paint.
does it have to have adhesion promotor? or would sanding roughly,priming, sanding smooth, and priming be sufficient?
tips/ tricks
no offense, but have a shop do it.
i am. thats what i need to gather the information for. i want to make sure they are going to do it right... so im trying to figure out what should be done.
take it to a shop that guarantees their work... problem solved. The only thing you're going to accomplish by "questioning" them on their methods is pi$$ them off. How would you like it if some random customer came up to you and started questioning you on how to do YOUR job?
not only that, but there are different methods that can be used that arn''t any more "wrong or right" than another method. It doesn't matter if A + B = C, or A + Q = C... as long as the end result is the same.
i have people question me about my job all the time... i was just looking for a brief idea of how its gonna work...
i dont want my paint to be chipping off from here to the moon and back. i do a lot of traveling (especially from home to college) 500 miles down I95 and im most likely moving down their next year... and the beach isnt nice to paint, or cars in general. i dont feel i should have to question their process, but i also dont feel that their guarantee/warantee should need to be looked into soon after completion.
Herb Wilson wrote:i have people question me about my job all the time... i was just looking for a brief idea of how its gonna work...
i dont want my paint to be chipping off from here to the moon and back. i do a lot of traveling (especially from home to college) 500 miles down I95 and im most likely moving down their next year... and the beach isnt nice to paint, or cars in general. i dont feel i should have to question their process, but i also dont feel that their guarantee/warantee should need to be looked into soon after completion.
Questioning their process isn't going to help. The only way to cover your arse is to make sure that the shop DOES guarantee their work. If they guarantee their work, don't you think they'd want to do it right? They're not going to want to fix your car again for nothing... and no matter what you do, that amount of driving you're going to get rock chips and such, there is no way around that short of getting a bra for the car, and even then if it's not taken care of properly you can still eff up your paint.
Pick a place that offers a lifetime guarantee on their work. No paint warranty will cover against rock chips or someone accidentally scratching up your car... but they will cover any defect related to prep work, paint, etc.
ok for real whats wrong with asking what process they take to do there work?
when ever have had body work (or any work on a car for that matter) i ask questions.
nothing wrong with it, i still have the same mechanic and body guy i have always had, and because i asked questions and they explained i know now i can trust them.
If they are goin to get pissed off about you asking what process they take thats just lame.
im not saying they need to be a school teacher and teach you how to paint but they should be able to take 5-10 min to answer any questions you have.
it is your car, your paying for it you deserve to know and frankly if they are goin to get pissed off they dont need my business.
but anyways herb i wish i had the answer, unfortunately i dont.
From what Fallen Angel said i would guess there is a few different ways.
you could ask them that question and then come back here, tell us what they said, and then someone like Fallen Angel, who knows tons about this subject, can tell you they sound good or they are full of it.
as all ready said make sure the shop guarantees their work that should solve most of your problems
ps Fallen Angel this is not meant to offend you in anyway just my opinion
Reberrabbit wrote:ok for real whats wrong with asking what process they take to do there work?
when ever have had body work (or any work on a car for that matter) i ask questions.
nothing wrong with it, i still have the same mechanic and body guy i have always had, and because i asked questions and they explained i know now i can trust them.
If they are goin to get pissed off about you asking what process they take thats just lame.
im not saying they need to be a school teacher and teach you how to paint but they should be able to take 5-10 min to answer any questions you have.
it is your car, your paying for it you deserve to know and frankly if they are goin to get pissed off they dont need my business.
but anyways herb i wish i had the answer, unfortunately i dont.
From what Fallen Angel said i would guess there is a few different ways.
you could ask them that question and then come back here, tell us what they said, and then someone like Fallen Angel, who knows tons about this subject, can tell you they sound good or they are full of it.
as all ready said make sure the shop guarantees their work that should solve most of your problems
ps Fallen Angel this is not meant to offend you in anyway just my opinion
I understand what you''re saying and take no offense. I shall explain my reasoning for not answering the question so maybe anyone wondering why I''m not answering the question will understand.
For example: When I was working at Faulkner Pontiac in Hanover, the "painter" (and I use the term loosely... he went to "paint school" and thought he knew everything after only painting for 6 months) was doing something, and I was asked to prep this OEM replacement bumper for paint. Many OEM replacement bumpers come with no primer or anything on them... just bare "plastic", which btw scratches VERY EASILY!!! I was taught to clean the hell out of it with wax and grease remover (to get rid of any residual chemicals that may be left over from the molding process), and to scuff it with a very fine scuff pad, getting in the nooks and crannies, etc. The "all knowing painter", sat there and watched me prep this damn thing, and waited until I was done to tell me "you don't do it THAT way... you do it THIS way!" His method being to use a very fine grit sandpaper and hit the bumper with an orbital sander. I was taught that using that method COULD result in leaving the bumper surface with little dips or an uneven surface... to do it by hand with a scuff pad. So I said "Fine, you don't like the way I do it... YOU do it then".
I later asked him "Let me ask you a question. If you have way 1 of doing things, and I have way 2 of doing things, and the end result is exactly the same... which way is right?" He replied "Well... I guess both are right then". Exactly. Then again this was coming from the painter who on my first day there said "Women don''t belong around cars, in garages, or shops... period".
Many things in the auto body/paint world don't have ONE way of doing something "right". There are some things where you do it one way, and one way only... but many things can be done differently and still be right.
So... if I sit here and type of the way that I would say is "my" right way of doing things... and he goes into the shop and asks them how they do it... and their way is different... and he (or anyone) says "well I asked an auto body / paint professional on this car site I'm on and he/she said to do it this way"... how is that going to affect them? "Oh well fine then... if you know how to do it, then why don't YOU do it?"
You have to understand that in that particular profession, shops do have to deal with people all the time who come in there thinking they know everything and how it should be done more so than the people in the shop who usually have years of experience. Granted they may not get "pissed off" per say, but it''s highly irritating to have people come in and second guess your work all the time. Yes there are shops out there who arn't' reputable and do half assed work. You get that in any profession.
But again, since there is no ONE way to "properly" prep a bumper or whatever for paint... it would be pointless for me or anyone else to give anyone one way of doing it, because maybe that shop does things differently and it would be creating a false sense of security in what "should" be done when he does ask the shop... hence why I simply said to just make sure the shop offers a guarantee on their work (most reputable shops at least around here offer a lifetime guarantee on their work for defects and flaws and such).
So... I hope that cleared some things up... if not feel free to ask where I need to clarify more.
Beleive me, question them and find out your answers. I have been to two seperate DEALERS to have parts painted and I will never go back to them. They clearly do not know what needs to be done to have paint adhere to urethane as I have had a host of issues with the paint on my bumper chipping and peeling off. The factory bumper, I never had a hitch with, but when I switched to a GT front and had the dealer paint it, it has never been properly painted. Arm yourself with information and do not be afraid to ask questions.
Fallen Angel, I assume he wants to know if there is a special flex primer, etching, etc that needs to be applied prior to paint. Most reputable shops do not mind being asked questions and explaining what process they do to complete the work. Any shop that is not willing to explain to you what they are doing are generally the ones who are shady or doing poor quality work. If you have a problem with what I just said, PM me, no point jacking this post any further.
So, back on topic, what is required for painting urethane?
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ramairsedan wrote:Beleive me, question them and find out your answers. I have been to two seperate DEALERS to have parts painted and I will never go back to them. They clearly do not know what needs to be done to have paint adhere to urethane as I have had a host of issues with the paint on my bumper chipping and peeling off. The factory bumper, I never had a hitch with, but when I switched to a GT front and had the dealer paint it, it has never been properly painted. Arm yourself with information and do not be afraid to ask questions.
Fallen Angel, I assume he wants to know if there is a special flex primer, etching, etc that needs to be applied prior to paint. Most reputable shops do not mind being asked questions and explaining what process they do to complete the work. Any shop that is not willing to explain to you what they are doing are generally the ones who are shady or doing poor quality work. If you have a problem with what I just said, PM me, no point jacking this post any further.
So, back on topic, what is required for painting urethane?
I don''t have a problem with what you said per say, it's more that you didn't read what I wrote.
I said there is no ONE way of prepping a bumper correctly, and that if I gave him my way, and the shop did it a different way, he may think their way is wrong when it''s not. I never said a shop should have a problem in explaining their method to anyone... but I DID say a shop MAY have an issue or not like it if someone starts QUESTIONING their work. So obviously you did not comprehend my differentiation between "Asking questions" and "Questioning".
If you simply ask questions, it should not be a problem. But if you QUESTION their method... that's different... example:
Shop says their process for prepping urethane is you do A, B, C, D, E, F, G. You reply with "Well so and so said that you should do it this way, G, F, E, D, C, B, A." That is questioning their work. I am speaking purely from a professional courtesy standpoint... if you don''t want to believe me or anything I say and do it your own way... fine...
If you read... my point was there is no ONE way to say is proper for the process than another necessarily.
WHICH IS WHY I SAID THE BEST METHOD IS TO MAKE SURE THE SHOP OFFERS A GUARANTEE ON THEIR PAINT!!!!!
If that's still not understandable, I can offer you my rhetoric and comprehension books from my college course to help you out a bit. Sorry to come off bitchy, but I stated several times already the reasoning and it seems you didn't thoroughly read my explanation, or you wouldn't have made your post the way you did.
worst thread EVA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
yea this is getting a tad out of hand.
I understand what everyone is saying.
Fallen angel is saying she doesn't want to say i was taught this is the proper way and you to think any other way is wrong
But i understand that Herb doesn't want to go through the hassle if they don't do it properly to get it fixed (and i have had that stuff happen even with stuff with guarantee)
Best thing to do is find a good shop that is recommended that has a guarantee(Try your regionals form), if your still uneasy ask them their process, if it sounds fishy comeback here and ask someone and if your still not sure well i guess you shouldn't get you bumper painted
ok now can we all show some love?
this thread isnt that bad... haha but it is kinda bad... lifetime warranty on the paint... so i hope all is good, i just dont want to have to waste my time to take it back for repairs should anything be wrong... i guess im alone on that.
You know what... if it''s still not comprehendable after how many times I''ve explained this... we'll do it this way because I''m only getting increasingly agitated with the senseless pointless arguing of this topic by people who are not qualified to answer the question.
**********WARNING************* Yes as you will see from my post I've had a @!#$ty day, and have about had it with the stupid petty arguing by people on this forum who have no clue what they're talking about arguing with those who do. Maybe I've been on this site too long... January will be 6 years. Don't like what I have to say, buy a helmet, or don't read it. And people wonder why so very many of the "veterans" on this site have left who actually posessed helpful knowledge... anyway on to my rant
So... if ya'll are so freaking hell bent on a answer... go to the damn shop... ask them their process... and post it up here already.... and I may take a look at it.
i''m not going to sit here and spend hours typing up every damn possible "correct" way to do this. I have a sh*tload of more important things to do with my time... like having a life and my college work. So if any of you can''t seem to understand with how many NUMEROUS times I''ve explained why I haven't given one definitive answer, then go back and read again SSLLLOOOWWWWLLLYYYYYY.
Again... I''m not wasting hours of my time going over every possible way to correctly do this... and if you expect me to do that, then maybe yet another auto body tech/painter should leave teh forum and stop trying to help anyone. If you haven't noticed, there''s VERY few of us on here to begin wtih, and even fewer who post regularly.
So... if you''re that hell bent on your "answers", question your damn shop, and post whatever they told you, but make sure it is verbatim and you havve not left out one single freaking thing... otherwise that could taint the answer you would be given by a professional as to whether or not that is correct.
Unless there''s another auto body / paint tech on here (who''s not IN school for it... who has years of actual experience) who wants to spend a few hours typing your damn stupid answer.
This is one of the dumbest posts I've seen made in here. You bring your stuff to a professional because they know what the hell they''re doing. In any case, in any profession, you have people who do not know what they're doing. Do you go onto cell phone forums and question the shizz out of them about their service, phones, etc?? Do you go to different grocery stores and question them about the processes they use in which to slaughter their animals so you can eat them? What about the farmers? Do you go to the farmers who grow your vegetables to ask them about their growing process to see if it's sufficient for you?
my apologies to the OP for my harsh response... it wasn't really directed at you... I'm just about fed up with trying to help just about anyone on here anymore... no one listens anyway
i understand your frustration... i was originally just trying to get a feel for whether that would be a general idea of what could be done, as well as some possible products to be used...
i didnt want it to get out of hand or anything... but i have seen a bunch of posts on prepping paint and none applied to me...
so if someone gets some time, just throw up an idea or two on how YOU would prep the eurethane body kit for paint.
sorry everybody thinks this post sucks.... ill keep quiet.
thanks for your help fallen angel, hopefully tomorrow is better
wow this thread sure got angry, back off of her guys she is tryin to help out, and like she said the old guys that have the experience dont comeon here all that often any more due to @!#$ like this
but you want a write up online well here ya go
so if the bumper is a raw plastic it must be washed with warm soapy water, if it is still slick wash it one more time, if it is still slick if the booth has baking capabilties,, cook it for 20 mins then as soon as its done wipe it down right away with plastic prep solvent ppg is dx103 and then right away spray the adheshion promoter then that has to sit for 30 mins, so i n ppg a sealer can be sprayed over the promoter,, then base then clear but clear mixed with flex agent for us body men
if the bumper has primer on it scuff it with 320 then a red scuff pad, wipe it with dx 330, sealer base then flex clear
there are ya happy, so back off of her she was tryin to help
can i haz bondo
big daddy wrote:wow this thread sure got angry, back off of her guys she is tryin to help out, and like she said the old guys that have the experience dont comeon here all that often any more due to @!#$ like this
but you want a write up online well here ya go
so if the bumper is a raw plastic it must be washed with warm soapy water, if it is still slick wash it one more time, if it is still slick if the booth has baking capabilties,, cook it for 20 mins then as soon as its done wipe it down right away with plastic prep solvent ppg is dx103 and then right away spray the adheshion promoter then that has to sit for 30 mins, so i n ppg a sealer can be sprayed over the promoter,, then base then clear but clear mixed with flex agent for us body men
if the bumper has primer on it scuff it with 320 then a red scuff pad, wipe it with dx 330, sealer base then flex clear
there are ya happy, so back off of her she was tryin to help
Thank you, thank you
. You did forget to mention though the fact that there is more than one way to prep a bumper (but if anyone reads they can see the way I posted is different than even what he said... which just illustrates my point.
And like some kits I've seen... sometimes the primer that comes on the bumper is so crappy, you actually need to strip it all off and reprime. I dealt with a kit like that once... went to sand the primer to get it ready... and it got gummy and "flaked" off...
there's just too many circumstances to list...
hopefully mine doesnt suck to bad when i get it back tomorrow
lol
thanks again for the pro info
