Since I had nothing else to do, I decided to install my Greddy E-Manage system yesterday night. Installation was fairly smooth. I took Jay's advice and soldered into the harness as close as I could to the ECU.
I double checked my wiring, crossed my fingers, and hit the starter. Success....at least I think.
The car sounded fine (of course, it was in closed loop mode) after I started it up. I then decided to go grab my laptop, support tool, and OBD-II scan tool to do some initial tuning. When I came back to the car (about 10 minutes later. Took me a while to get the USB to Serial drivers installed), the car was surging between idle of 900rpm and around 1300rpm. I then noticed the Active LED was flashing orange. I then tried to mess with the air-flow adjust volume (A.A.V.) to see if the LED would switch to a green light. Sure enough, it switched over just fine. I dialed the A.A.V. adjusters to somewhat correct the lean situation I'm experiencing on the vechicle. From 2000rpm-6000rpm, I used +20,+20,+15,+10,+5. As I messed with the 2000rpm setting, the car immediately started to idle normally.
Without changing any other parameters, I then decided to run around the block to see if the car can actually drive. I drove along at roughly 10mph on our snow packed roads and then pushed a little harder on the accelerator to break loose the tires. This allowed me to see whether or not the rest of the rpm range was having problems just like my idle was. From what I could tell, things were good. At this point, I don't recall whether or not I blipped the throttle or not but when I looked over at the E-Manage, the Active LED was flashing red. I turned the car off and then turned it back on to read the trouble code. The code I'm getting is number 11: Airflow Signal 1 input error. Also known as the MAP sensor signal.
I recall seeing somewhere that E-Manage J-body owners were tripping MAP sensor codes when doing a hard pull. Is this the code that's being tripped? How do I correct this issue? Like I said, I've double checked my wiring and it seems to be ok. I guess I could switch the MAP sensor wires around to see if I got them backwards. However, I do recall doing MAP to white wire, and Green wire to PCM. I didn't really get a huge chance to properly do an initial tune on the unit so I could be missing something there as well.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm probably going to head out to the car at lunchtime and fiddle with it some more. Right now, the E-Manage is disconnected and I have jumper wires connecting the MAP and ignition lines together.
One last thing. Just wanted to confirm like other have that pin number 10 on the ECU's C2 connector DOES indeed have an rpm signal coming out of it on my 2000 Z-24. I wish I would of known about that wire when I had an ignition computer on my previous car. <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
wouldnt running a check valve setup fix this? just wondering..
i know the emanage is supposed to play nice with stock computer but this might avoid more issues. <br>
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
No check valves needed. My car is a 2000 with the GM S/C and reflash. Therefore, I'm using the 2 Bar MAP sensor. <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
im listening cause im adding this to my gm s/c programed car
<br>
<img src=http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/brandonfetter/fettersig.jpg>
R.I.P. Brian Klocke, you will never be forgotten
Ok, I played it at lunchtime. I didn't notice last night but the E-Manage tripped the MAP code again just at idle. I managed to get rid of all of the surging and the MAP code tripping by screwing around with the A.A.V., A/F trim, and a tiny bit of additional injection at idle.
I went out for a ride around the block again. As I expected, the car is running really rich due to the fact that the A.A.V. settings are so high. I'll trim them out soon enough. What I'm concerned with now is that the MAP code still tripped while driving around. Even without getting on the throttle, the code tripped.
Jay, I need some help with this. I need a step-by-step of how to approach this. Such as:
Idle
1. A.A.V. (Make rich, tune down)
2. A/F (" ")
3. Additional Injection. (" ")
Mid
etc. etc.
Hi End
etc. etc.
Thanks in advance for the help guys. BTW: The A.A.V. values I posted above have changed. Dont' know them offhand since I'm not in the car. I'll do more experimenting and post some results after work. <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
I'd highly recommend, since you do have the support tool and a laptop, putting the aav dials back to no change. There's really no sense in using these adjustment points since you have a ton more control over the airflow values using the airflow adjustment map.
At this point, the only maps you should have your emanage using should be the airflow adjustment and the additional injection. Try to stay away from the anti-stall and others for now (I've heard of throttle response issues with the anti-stall map. i don't know for sure as I've never had a need to use it).
As for triggering the error codes, I really have no answer. I get the same errors. My best understanding of the problems is that the MAP Sensor Voltage Low CEL that I get is due to trimming fuel at idle using the airflow adjustment map. I'm trimming out fuel because of the larger injectors. Or, it could be due to a "delay" in the signal since it has to pass through the emanage before getting to the PCM. I'm not sure how touchy our PCMs are.I haven't found in your post whether or not you are using the injectors for the GM S/C with your reflash. If so, or you aren't using any larger injectors than what the reprogram calls for, leaving the maps and aav dials completely alone (by loading in zeroed maps) should cause your car to run exactly as it did before you installed the emanage. If it doesn't, you may want to double-check your emanage's error codes to make sure you don't have an injector wiring issue.
I'm sort of confused as to why you're running the Emanage. Are you using a much larger pulley than stock? It seems to me that if you are, the only thing you'd need to do is add more fuel "up top" in the additional injection map. But at the same time, I don't know enough about the reprogram to know whether you'll be running lean up there or if the reflash handles a good fuel map up to the threshold of the 2 bar map. Anyone?
Sorry if this is a ramble. I'm tired.
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
Thanks for responding Jay.
I figured out the A.A.V. settings don't really mean a thing with the support tool and injection harness so that's all good now.
I read a post on the E-Manage Yahoo group that the MAP sensor problem happens due to the fact that our sensors go nearly to 0 volts when a vacuum is put onto them. Aparhently, the E-Manage doesn't like having no signal. Somebody in the thread suggested using the boost clamp to enforce a minimum setting but I haven't been able to figure out how to do that yet.
Yes, I do have the S/C injectors installed. Everything is mostly fine and dandy when the settings are left at zero. However, I get a surge that starts out real small (maybe 50rpm difference. can feel it through the poly motor mounts) and then bounces between 900-1300rpms. Meaning, the surge is 400rpms wide between 900 and 1300 on the tach.
Here's my last dyno run before the E-Manage was installed:
The A/F alone should explain why I put the thing on the car. Not to mention, yes, I'm going to open up the exhaust, install a smaller (smaller is more boost) pulley, and put on a P&P head I've had sitting in my room for about a year. I've got plans, I'd just like the fuel to be correctable beforehand.
I should also mention I have a walbro 255lph pump installed. Works fine.
My question now is, does this MAP code deactivate anything in the E-Manage or can I just ignore it?
Thanks again for your help.
<br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Ahh I see.
I've never heard anywhere about a "limp" mode in the emanage when a code is triggered. There's certainly no documentation of it.
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
HMMMMMM.......
It seems that no one would listen to me before but a few people who new better than to think that an E-manage would work correctly.
Jrobbz....check valves do not work properly either. The emanage wont work correctly with a stock PCM. The map sensor and the emanage dont mix. Like i have said, the emanage was not made for the Cavaliers.
There is a way to rig it and that is by using an MSM. Haas makes and sells them.
JAY, there is documentation of the limp mode.
See, isnt using this system such a pain in the ass. I dont htink anyone is using the emanage for everything is can do or is. if they tried, they would know it wouldnt work.
I beg to differ about it NOT working. Granted, there is an annoying red LED flashing constantly on the main unit. Give me solid evidence showing that this reflects a shutdown of the system rather than a warning. <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
proof? sure, absolutely! call Greddy. I have toyed with an emanage several times.
Well, Mike Andrews, my car would beg to differ with it not working correctly. I'd guess that it works just fine. 48,000 miles turbocharged (98,000 miles total) and zero problems with the car, aside from fabrication issues with the manifold and downpipe. I'm really not sure there's a better testimony than that. I drive my car every single day. It's my only vehicle aside from an s-10 that doesn't run. It's made 5+ hour trips to two j-body bashes now along with numerous trips to st louis for fun. I guess it really sucks, huh?
Where's this documentation of limp mode? Please link me to it.
http://www.mohdparts.com/ has jpeg scans of every page of the user manuals for the main unit and the support tool. I must have missed it and would really like to see it. And which number did you call for Greddy? Unless you're an authorized Greddy dealer and installer, they won't support you with the E-manage.
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
hehe, ouch!
That's true Jay. Your car is testimony to it working full time due to the fact that you are boosted and don't use an FMU to manage your fuel (pointless if the E-Manage is working properly.)
Thanks again Jay for your help. All I gotta do now is get on a friggin dyno and tune. Gotta get a new clutch and install a smaller pulley before I go and do that though. <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Addendum: FYI, my ONLY fuel mods are the emanage and Vortech (Ford) 24 lbs/hr injectors. Stock fuel pump, stock FPR, no FMU.
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
You ever manage to get any quarter mile times or dyno numbers with that car yet? <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Mr. Pute wrote:You ever manage to get any quarter mile times or dyno numbers with that car yet?
If you're speaking to me, it's slow. It's a damn 2.2 automatic for crying out loud
My best quarter mile time is 16 flat running 6 psi. Street trim, complete with stereo and my lard ass, and I wasn't very good at launching the car in boost. *end ricer excuses*
I didn't build a racecar, though. I built a fun street car. I scored.
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
JayP2k, What is up man? Long time no talk lol. Any ways I support you guys. I my self also have the e-manage and I like it. I do get that code once and a while, but no limp mode. If there was a limp mode I would have blown my car up several times by now. I have about 100,000 miles on my cav and been turbocharger for 50,000 of them. Not one problem. I have ran it down the track several time and had it on the dyno several times.
At 8 psi on the dyno with the emanage I put down 246 hp and 256 torque. We had to shut it down early because of a miss fire due to bad plugs and a weak ignition.
Now I have a MSD DIS II raised the boost to 12-13 psi and spray nitrous through the intercooler. All with the e-manage and it runs great. I have not yet had it back on the dyno since the curent modifications, but by the general rule of thumb 10 hp per pound of boost, I should be around 286 hp with out the nitrous to the wheels. Just so I don't get burned by some unediucated guru, This Is Just An Estimate based off a good rule of thumb. I am let to believe that 10 hp per pound of boost is a forgiving figure based on the compressor efficiency. It could be more.
I also drive my car every day. I have taken it on a ton of road trips and not a single problem. I also have no internal modifications done to the engine, it is still stock.
I hope this helps people see that the e-manage is a useful tool.
Good Luck Mr. Pute
JayP2k, hope to see you around again some time
Jamie S.
and you are a "real tool"
Mike Andrews wrote:and you are a "real tool"
Is that all you've got? Thanks for playing. Maybe you should wear a helmet while swinging from Haas' nuts.
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
Mike Andrews wrote:and you are a "real tool"
Please go jack someone else's thread. This is for E-Manage discussion only at this point. <br>
<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Boy, some one always has to spoil the fun huh? People post on here to help other people out.
Maybe you have had better luck with other pieces of equipment, maybe you haven't and are just jealous and that is why you are on here just burnnig people up.
To tell you the truth pal, these types of replys are totaly un helpful and un cool. That is why I am hardly ever on here. Things like this turn helpful forums into pure crap, because every thing turns in to a flame throwing match.
Why don't you try and be helpful some time, instead of spitting out these unsophisticated comments.
Have a nice day buddy
u know....i said i was done with u....but jesus christ are u retarded.
To bring the thread back on track..............
Jaime,
If you have the ignition harness for your Emanage, why do you need the MSD???
<br>
Jason
99 Z24
#25 to register on the Org !!
www.newdawncustoms.com
Johnny Mack Turbo Systems
Engineered Performance
Russ is a moron anyway and MR pute will still continue to have problems until he listens to those who have had more experience than one person on one car.
Mike Andrews wrote:Russ is a moron anyway and MR pute will still continue to have problems until he listens to those who have had more experience than one person on one car.
You can't even count. There's more than one person posting in this thread that's had success with the Greddy E-manage. I'd say that's proof enough that the e-manage can work for us. What more do you need? Seriously? What's your malfunction?
<br>
<a href="http://www.cavyjason.com/"><img src="http://www.cavyjason.com/photos/night-banner.jpg" border=0></a>
