I know a few people have swapped their head out for the LSJ head.
Im wondering what the benefit of going with a LSJ head is over going with a stock L61? Im going to be doing a ported head in the future here and if im going to swap I might as well swap the better head on there.
If it matters im supercharged.
Add better looking to that list. IMO.
Pj made a thread on it awhile ago. Definitely better in almost every way like mentioned. Bigger ports, better material, more material to hog out on a port job. The biggest problem to overcome is the power steering. I'm not sure but you may be able to take the removable plate off the end of the cam housing and hook it up. You'd have to play with it. The other issue is the pcv slot being moved on the intake. But since you're blown and running the lsj intake it should work perfectly. Other than that I think you'll just have to do a little gasket matching with the head gasket; no biggie. Take pictures if you go though with this!
"In Oldskool we trust"
How is the biggest problem to overcome the power steering? I took the old head off, layed the power steering pump in the engine bay, put the new head on. Lifted the power steering pump up and put the hex into the cam and bolted it in... Nothing tough about it at all or hard to overcome.
If you use L61 cams in it, you have to have some extra work done. M2 recently did 5-6 LSJ heads for a few of us and has the process nailed down. Travis pretty much nailed all the benefits. I had an L61 head fault due to the porosity of the casting.
BuiltNBoosted wrote:How is the biggest problem to overcome the power steering? I took the old head off, layed the power steering pump in the engine bay, put the new head on. Lifted the power steering pump up and put the hex into the cam and bolted it in... Nothing tough about it at all or hard to overcome.
Didn't know it bolted up; that's awesome news. And he's already blown so I'd see no reason not to run the LSJ cams unless tuning is an issue.
"In Oldskool we trust"
Different grinds for L61 cams. Im running the stage 3 turbo cams from comp cams in my LSJ/L61....
How did you remedy the exhaust cam situation? Just for future reference
"In Oldskool we trust"
Drill and tap the last oil journal and put a plug in it, as well as make an end cap cover where the cobalt CPS would be.
Or for the supercharged guys, you can use the LSJ cams, and just get a custom tune. and not have to mod the head at all except the cover plate for the cam sensor.
I believe the cam timing is different between the LSJ and L61.
....**Vince......Does M2 do the blocking as well or your talking about the porting? Do you have to mod the head gasket or can you use the stock L61 head gasket?
Actually I cant see how a tune would fix incorrect cam timing. The cams are physically linked to the crank. Unless I used adjustable cam gears but in the end its going to be easier to just use L61 cams and fill the oil galley. A quick drill and tap and done.
Philly D wrote:I believe the cam timing is different between the LSJ and L61.
....**Vince......Does M2 do the blocking as well or your talking about the porting? Do you have to mod the head gasket or can you use the stock L61 head gasket?
he does it all, he did my port and polish, he assembled my head as well as he put that plug in for me. Im using the LSJ head gasket because its said to be a better overall gasket anyway.
Philly D wrote:Actually I cant see how a tune would fix incorrect cam timing. The cams are physically linked to the crank. Unless I used adjustable cam gears but in the end its going to be easier to just use L61 cams and fill the oil galley. A quick drill and tap and done.
think about this...and take into your thoughts that i might be 100% wrong...but if the cams physically work on a cobalt ss with a blower, why would it not work for us?
heads are the same physically structurally (mainly) so its not a interferance issues, stroke of the motors is the same isnt it? so why would it not be able to be fixed with a awesome tune? it would then be an ignition timing things and all that would it not? am i completely wrong here? how would it be different then tuning for any other cam?
BuiltNBoosted wrote:Im running the stage 3 turbo cams from comp cams in my LSJ/L61....
Stage 3 turbo cams? I call sheens.
Philly D wrote:Actually I cant see how a tune would fix incorrect cam timing. The cams are physically linked to the crank. Unless I used adjustable cam gears but in the end its going to be easier to just use L61 cams and fill the oil galley. A quick drill and tap and done.
the grind (from what I understand) from the LSJ to the L61 is the same, except the timing is changed... most likely the overlap (reduced because supercharger) and the valve timing (again because supercharger)
if you are supercharged, running L61 cams you're worse off.
switching to the LSJ cams with a supercharger is better for you.
the extra benefit is not having to worry about the empty cam journal.
also, I'm not sure how tuning won't fix "incorrect cam timing".
there is no "correct" cam timing.
cam timing (valve events and duration) is always a compromise with fixed cam engines (read: NON VVT).
the only incorrect cam timing is when your valves smash into your pistons.
also,
the lsj head does not flow better than the L61 head. the advantage with it is the better casting, which allows for more aggressive porting.
the valvetrain is not an upgrade either with the exception of the sodium filled valves.
you also need to run LSJ specific spark plugs because they have a crush-seal seat, while the L61 has a conical seat.
Thanks PJ.
As for the cam timing I guess I was brain farting. I was thinking if the cams are keyed 90* from where the L61 cams are. Anyways..
Has anyone run LSJ specific cams before?? If so it opens up a huge market up for us in terms of cams through ZZP.
blackbirdracing wrote:BuiltNBoosted wrote:Im running the stage 3 turbo cams from comp cams in my LSJ/L61....
Stage 3 turbo cams? I call sheens.
duh.... good call. my brain farted.... im running stage 3's from comp cams.
DaFlyinSkwirl (Pj) v2.0 wrote:also,
the lsj head does not flow better than the L61 head. the advantage with it is the better casting, which allows for more aggressive porting.
wouldnt it flow better if you could do more aggressive porting? flow better after the port and polish that is.
DaFlyinSkwirl (Pj) v2.0 wrote:
the grind (from what I understand) from the LSJ to the L61 is the same, except the timing is changed... most likely the overlap (reduced because supercharger) and the valve timing (again because supercharger)
The grinds are slightly different but not really anything worth debating over. The primary differences are the valve timing differences. I believe if I can recall accurately the Intake has an advanced 16' difference and the exhaust is something like 7' retarded from the L61 cams.
ASE Master Certified Automotive Technician
BuiltNBoosted wrote:DaFlyinSkwirl (Pj) v2.0 wrote:also,
the lsj head does not flow better than the L61 head. the advantage with it is the better casting, which allows for more aggressive porting.
wouldnt it flow better if you could do more aggressive porting? flow better after the port and polish that is.
that's what pj said... in stock form, the lsj head doesn't flow better but there is more meat for a more aggressive port job. (assuming you are porting/polishing the head it should flow better than a ported l61 head)
i was looking at running the lsj head as well with the stock cams until i would have money to port/upgrade. almost like a mini blower grind vs the l61 bump sticks.
If in fact I can run a set of LSJ cams versus say the Comp Cams blower grind. Ill be going with a set of ZZP stage 2 blower cams. Then porting the head.
Im just leary about slapping the LSJ cams in and timing it just like the L61.
But for the time being I may just do that and slap the LSJ head on with the stock LSJ cams and get a tune. That would probably put me as close to breaking point of the motor as id like to be going anyways ( along with the other things I got planned)
This thread is making be rethink my plans for a L61 head. The LSJ is starting to look better.
