Hey guys,
Just wondering what a capacitor really does? i know it's for amps and such but that is about it. thanks !
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caps suck.......don't use one!
ok that answered my question? now what do they do.....
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A cap stores energy, and releases it. It's like a battery -sort of. It's faster at releasing stored energy than a battery, but it doesn't hold a charge for as long as a battery. Also, once it is discharged, it takes more time for power to get through it.
Essentially, if you have a quick bass hit, it may help out, but if there's a long bass hit (rap, bass cd) it will be discharged, and it will take longer for the energy to get from the alt or battery to the amp. Also, if you wire it in paralell with the alternator, you'll end up putting more load on your alt, and your battery won't charge as fast either.
I think that's the quick and dirty of it.
don't listen to these morons, a capacitor stores energy and discharges it quickly. They also help to clean up the power going into amps etc so there aren't sharp peaks and dips. They do not provide additional power. so if your system draws 200 amps, and you have a 150 amp alt, your bat will still die, and your system will be choppy.
for a good explanation...
Quote:
Stiffening Caps
What are they? What do they do, really?
This definition will be in its simplest form. You will see audio capacitors referred to as Stiffening Capacitors. A capacitor is a devise that stores electrical energy. Well, you say that’s what a battery does. Well yes it does, but the difference is the ability and speed that this electrical energy is able to be discharged.
Batteries are designed to store electrical energy for long periods of time. A battery also discharges slowly. A capacitor charges and discharges very rapidly. The reason behind this is due to the internal resistance of both devices. A battery has a high resistance that allows for long-term energy storage and a slow discharge. The capacitor has virtually no internal resistance, which allows for rapid charges and discharges.
An amplifier requires current as music signal passes through it. This creates transient signals in the amplifier. The problem occurs when many of these signal come in rapid succession in a short period of time. The time we are talking about are very small fractions of a second (milliseconds). If your electrical system is unable to react to this it causes a sagging effect in the audio output.
As the current goes up, so must the voltage. Since you can’t increase the voltage as the current requirement increases we get a decrease in voltage and this decrease in voltage causes a sagging power supply. Amplifiers work best at 14.5 volts and can easily overcome a factory installed alternator current output capacity. When the engine is turned off, the system requirements are supplied by the battery increasing the problem of supplying the transient requirements. You could add 10 or 20 more batteries and it wouldn’t help. Remember, as we explained above batteries can’t supply energy quickly enough to supply the transient needs of the amplifier. Please note that these transients may be 100 amps. They occur so fast that your fuse will not be effected, remember this takes place in milliseconds.
By adding a large stiffening capacitor to your amplifier input power line you should be able to meet these transient requirements. Remember as we explained above, a capacitor can store energy very fast and discharge energy very fast. This should solve the transient current requirement to the amplifier.
The voltage of the capacitor can only be the same as the alternator output or if the engine is off, to the level of the battery. So, as you can see a capacitor doesn’t maintain battery levels. If you are still having energy shortages to operate your system you may need to look into a high output alternator.
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Caps do help your system and help level out your voltage but it only covers up the problem. That your alt cant keep up with your current draw. Best bet is save the money for your cap and use it on a H.O. Alt. then add a cap. In lamest terms think of a cap like a sponge it sucks up energy stores alot of it and gives out a steady constant flow. And the more pressure you put on in (ie. more demand for voltage) the more it will put out.
caps are not like batteries
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The main purpose for caps in the electronics world is to smooth out signals. They can boost voltage when the source voltage drops. However they can only do so much, and for an audio system, if your bass is cutting out often, a cap won't provide enough energy to solve the problem, which is why most people referr to them as bandaids.
ok, for everyone saying it's a bandaid.... if your current electrical system is capable of putting out enough power to run your setup, then you don't need to upgrade your alt and you may see benifits from a cap. ie. if your system draws 60 amps and your alt puts out 90amps, a new alt won't do you any good because the power requirement is already being met. granted there is a benifit to an alt running at 50% vs one running at 80% capacity all the time, but that's a differnt discusion.
A Cap will not create power, it will only help you manage the power that you alreay have.
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A Cap is a bandaid for a weak electrical system. The main thing to do, is upgrade the charging system. Running some 4 gauge wire (with a fuse of course) from the positive of the battery, to the positive of the alternator, then using some 4 gauge wire from the alternator ground to the chassis, and from the battery negative to the engine/transmission. Over at the Corsica boards, a friend of mine has a write up with pics.
It was done with a 3.1L V6, so the 2nd gen guys can relate pretty easily. 3rd gen, probably not too different except for locations.
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Chris wrote:The main purpose for caps in the electronics world is to smooth out signals. They can boost voltage when the source voltage drops. However they can only do so much, and for an audio system, if your bass is cutting out often, a cap won't provide enough energy to solve the problem, which is why most people referr to them as bandaids.
caps have nothing to do with your signal.
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A capacitor is a device that stores electrical charges on metallic plates separated by an insulating material. The purpose of a capacitor is to oppose a change in voltage. If the voltage dips, the capacitor discharges to try and maintain the voltage constant, also when the voltage comes back up, it tries to keep it at a lower level but then your alternator should have reserve capacity to overcome the opposition.
When your cars alternator is at it's limit in current output the voltage starts to decrease. This combined with the voltage loss along the power cables to the amplifier causes a power loss at the amplifier during heavy demand.
Think of it as a surge volume like a air tank attatched to a compressor. The air tank makes up for the limited volume output of the compressor by discharging when air pressure drops.
If your system is having voltage drops because of short bass hits then a cap can be a benefit. If it is seeing constant dropping of voltage because your alternator is too small to supply the constant current to your system then a cap will not help you at all and you should look at upgrading your electrical distribution system.
band aid for a bigger problem but better than nothing
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Rodimus Prime wrote:band aid for a bigger problem but better than nothing
personally i'd take nothing. i like my voltage thank you
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wysiwyg wrote:Chris wrote:The main purpose for caps in the electronics world is to smooth out signals. They can boost voltage when the source voltage drops. However they can only do so much, and for an audio system, if your bass is cutting out often, a cap won't provide enough energy to solve the problem, which is why most people referr to them as bandaids.
caps have nothing to do with your signal.
Cap's stop low frequency signals (which is why 'bass blockers' are just small capacitors). A drop in voltage from your alt or battery is a low frequency signal, which a cap will essentially absorb, making the output voltage appear not to drop. That's the 'signal' i'm talking about.
Chris wrote:The main purpose for caps in the electronics world is to smooth out signals. They can boost voltage when the source voltage drops. However they can only do so much, and for an audio system, if your bass is cutting out often, a cap won't provide enough energy to solve the problem, which is why most people referr to them as bandaids.
Oh boy....
The cap goes inline with the power wire from the battery, NOT the rca's from the source unit, and the voltage from the source unit will never drop anyways. It wont improve sound, nor smooth anything about (but your wallet)
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SlowRetta(Justin S) wrote:Chris wrote:The main purpose for caps in the electronics world is to smooth out signals. They can boost voltage when the source voltage drops. However they can only do so much, and for an audio system, if your bass is cutting out often, a cap won't provide enough energy to solve the problem, which is why most people referr to them as bandaids.
Oh boy....
The cap goes inline with the power wire from the battery, NOT the rca's from the source unit, and the voltage from the source unit will never drop anyways. It wont improve sound, nor smooth anything about (but your wallet)
If you have a 12V source and it's not constant, ie: lots of voltage fluxuations, it's referred to as a dirty "signal". The same with 120Vac or 480Vac or any other voltage. People who work with electricity (and especially electronics) know this.
a cap is good to have.... it stores voltage so you don't drain your batt...
We use it in electronics all the time, to store enegy so we don't drain the batt and the batt has time to recharge itself...
It can help against spikes and basically you should get one to be safe.. no necissary
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that is all
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SlowRetta(Justin S) wrote:Chris wrote:The main purpose for caps in the electronics world is to smooth out signals. They can boost voltage when the source voltage drops. However they can only do so much, and for an audio system, if your bass is cutting out often, a cap won't provide enough energy to solve the problem, which is why most people referr to them as bandaids.
Oh boy....
The cap goes inline with the power wire from the battery, NOT the rca's from the source unit, and the voltage from the source unit will never drop anyways. It wont improve sound, nor smooth anything about (but your wallet)
you don't know wtf you're talking about, no one was saying they went inline with the RCA's. Your source voltage can fluctuate from 11V-14.5V so learn what you're talking about before you start pretending you know what you're talking about
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LOL... these threads always go off topic... just answer the question folks, and if you don't know.. move along...
Ok, so caps work as Grimor described. Easy enough.
Do you need one? Depends... (as you can tell, everyone has a different opinion on it). Chances are probably not... but who knows... we don't know what you're running.
Assuming you've already upgraded "the big three" wires from the battery and alternator and grounds... and your alternator is putting out enough power to run the car and your system... and you've got a BIG system.... and you're getting the OCCASIONAL dip in power..... THEN you need a cap. Otherwise, no point. As you can see, there are many other things to spend time & money on before a cap.
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Lenko hits the nail on the head (and said what i said about 10 posts ago, although he said it more eloquently), caps will stop an OCCASIONAL drop in voltage. If that's what you have, then cool, don't bother with a huge battery etc, especially if you don't plan on going any bigger with amps etc. Otherwise, it might be a good idea to pursue other avenues to fix your problem.
