Hi, I'm Alex, first post to the forums, but a long time lurker. I have a 2000 Cavalier, which was parked at the curb. It was hit on the driver's side by a lady who couldn't negotiate the turn and came wide, bouncing off the front driver's side, which bent the fender badly and the rim as well. When I lift the car up and spin the wheel, it spins relatively straight. The problem is that when the steering wheel is centered, and the passenger side wheel looks straight, the wheel that got hit looks toed out way too far. The front of the wheel is angled outward, and the rear of the wheel inward. I inspected various parts of the suspension, and everything looks normal. Since her direction of travel was towards the back of my car, and I believe she pushed the rear of the wheel in, I think the tie rod and rack would have taken most of the force. The axle seems ok. The tie rod appears normal, so I guess the tie rod must have gotten pushed into the rack. Does this make sense? Am I looking at a rack replacement? If so, any recommendations on a howto for replacing the rack? Thanks all.
it could be just an inner tie rod end but i would replace the hole thing if a rack is cheap im not sure if the reman of new racks come with out tie rods so i would replace those to be on the safe side.
take it to a shop and ask them what they would suggest.
^Famous last words towards an up and coming post about how a shop did 3 hours worth of work and charged gross amounts of money.
Even if you want to be on the safe side, replace the control arm, entire steering rack, caliper, rotor, pads, brake line, wheel and bearing...then drive it to a shop and have the frame checked for straightness.........thats more than cautious and can be done very cheap. Easy to do aswell.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edited Monday, December 15, 2008 4:05 PM
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control arm, rack, caliper, rotor, pads, brake line, wheel and bearing CHEAP thats easily 500$ idk about cheap. i would replace the tie rod end then bring it to a shop and not tell them about the accident just ask for an aliment for the new rod end.
^damn....where do you get your parts? Control Arm -$20.00, Rack -$65.00, Caliper(BOTH-NEW REMAN) $20.00, Rotor (BOTH-NEW)-$40.00, Pads(BOTH-NEW) -$25.00, Brake Line $2.00, Wheel (Stocker) $95.00, Bearing $25.00
Total: $292 - and some of those parts are overpriced!
All of those prices I listed are VERY reasonable to pay for the parts with just a little trying at some of the following places: (eBay, jbo classifieds, junk yards).
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Have you driven the car (even just a little, on the road by your house or anything)? That would be my first thing I would do. If that went well, then I would probably take to a shop for a alignment and see what happens. If the rack, or tie rod are messed up they won't be able to do the alignment. Most shops will do a free inspection, get a list of parts that need replaced and then prices and take it to the lady who hit your car and have her pay to fix it.
FU Tuning
It sounds like it doesn't matter what it should cost, the person who hit you owes you for it.
If you're trying to be nice about it and save her money, a lot of those parts can be acquired at a salvage yard for very very reasonable (especially a u-pull-it type yard, www.pull-a-part.com for example).
A FRAME CONTROL ARM $14.35 ($2 core)
BRAKE CALIPER $9.43 ($2 core)
RACK & PINION STEERING (POWER) $37.32 ($5 core)
(from Dearman's post)
Rotor (BOTH-NEW)-$40.00
Pads(BOTH-NEW) -$25.00
Brake Line $2.00 (again, used? new hoses are normally ~25, unless you're talking hardline, and you can bend your own for cheap yes)
Wheel (Stocker) $95.00
Bearing $25.00 (used bearing? normally new sealed bearing units are ~80)
=257.10
and you *might* be able to find a wheel that matches at the pull-a-part
BAD TIRE ALUMINUM RIM $11.48 ($3 core) so you can knock another $80 off
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Sleeper style, they don't see it coming that way.
Wow dont listen to even HALF of these people!! You don't just start throwing parts at it. That's the dumbest thing you can do. Just take it to a reputable shop and have them do an alignment. If the alignment tech has half a brain then he will be able to interpret the readings to better direct you in what is bent, IF ANYTHING. I spent a lot of time as an alignment tech and there are a lot of instances where things are shifted and not bent. It is VERY unlikely a problem with the rack. You can always use your print out as reference if you wanna do your own repairs. 95% of the time it can be brought back into specification unless damage prevents it. When dealing with collisions the alignment rack is the first stop to repairs.
ASE Master Certified Automotive Technician
^O yeah, your right cause your the alignment man..........
Why change all the parts?
Would you like it if your neighbor knew he had a @!#$-UP car and tried to road it, coming around a corner he lost control and hit you? How about you Mr. alignment tech?
HE KNOWS HE VISUALLY HAS A PROBLEM WITH THE WHEELS TRACKING....if he woulda said...."I woke up this morning and my tires didn't look right...what should I do?" I would say, take it to an alignment shop. When he says he got hit by a 3K+ lbs. object at speed, followed by visually bent tracking you ALREADY KNOW your gonna be swapping parts! Where does it take a genius?
So......now...what parts to change? Obviously the control arm, cars bone of our legs, make sure its ok and just replace it. So your wheel got hit, obviously change that cause its probly out of round. If the wheel has been damaged you gotta go after the brakes and get them new. Next the rack as the knucle obviously got forced in on the backside and probly bent the rod if not stripped the gears in the rack.....I'd change the whole entire rack. The wheel bearing, comes to whatever you want to do, I would, but if you want to save money there's nothing wrong with trying the old one and see if you have any problems.
To the OP, this is the best advise on this thread...DO NOT listen to the "alignment tech"...he wont pay your law suit when your car crashed into something when you knew it wasn't road worthy!
Edited 3 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, December 16, 2008 6:10 AM
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-Joshua-
Nobody ever said he has to drive it there. Think outside the box sweetheart. I happen to work on cars for a living and can easily say I have built MULTIPLE of the most modified cars on this forum so if said poster would like to question my expertise then so be it but as for you helping him you are exactly right. You are helping him spend his money ignorantly when last time i checked people don't have a whole lot of extra cash laying around these days. Judging by your registry you have all the money in the world so maybe you would like to pay for all your recommended parts he should buy based on having never even seen the vehicle. The vehicle needs alignment readings PERIOD!!!!!!!!
ASE Master Certified Automotive Technician
^100% ignorant statement....dont care what YOU have done or DO for a living. We are talking about him, I'm not going to get into a penis measuring contest about this, really its a easy concept to grasp. You can't put a $$$ on your or his safety right? So why would you encourage somebody to save $300.00 and risk something of greater value? If somebody rear ended me, I'd have half a brain to double check my gas tank and even replace it if I felt there would be any reason to do so. Yeah, maybe I spend a little more money on the assurance through my ownership of cars, but I also know my ride is safe. I also know how to make my money go a long way by finding deals. I don't just throw cash at a useless problem. Along the same lines I trust (with my life) everyday I get on the road that others at least try to ensure their ride is safe aswell. I don't know what your thoughts are on that idea but I do know if you were involved in an accident with somebody and they had a issue with safety on their ride you wouldn't be so understanding and thinking "O.....they didn't have the money, that ipod they bought last week was a better buy instead of fixing their ride" -yeah right, you'd be pissed! Just like anybody else, so dont come at me thinking I like to convince others to spend money ignorantly.....just stop a minute and think about what your saying.
MY point is even if the alignment readings are ok, I wouldn't encourage anybody to trust that their equipment is ok just because a laser says so....what if the accident created a stress crack on a weld of his control arm or rotor or knucle? Would a laser tell you that? How can you just blindly "trust with your and others lives" that just because the laser says it is good that it really is? It was hit....hard enough to bend a tie rod at the least! F-that.....fix the problems with good parts first, then get the alignment knowing your ride is 100%. Wheres the lack of logic or ignorance in that?
Edited 2 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, December 16, 2008 10:50 AM
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CaliforniaDomestics wrote:Wow dont listen to even HALF of these people!! You don't just start throwing parts at it. That's the dumbest thing you can do. Just take it to a reputable shop and have them do an alignment. If the alignment tech has half a brain then he will be able to interpret the readings to better direct you in what is bent, IF ANYTHING. I spent a lot of time as an alignment tech and there are a lot of instances where things are shifted and not bent. It is VERY unlikely a problem with the rack. You can always use your print out as reference if you wanna do your own repairs. 95% of the time it can be brought back into specification unless damage prevents it. When dealing with collisions the alignment rack is the first stop to repairs.
I would do what is suggested by CaliforniaDomestics. I would not start throwing parts at my car if I was not 100% sure what was wrong. Every single shop I know off does a visual inspection WHILE they do the alignement, so if for some reason the car can not be brouhgt back into spec, they can tell you well you control arm is bent, or your tierod end is jacked. I would trust Alan's advice. Not only because he used to be an alignment tech, but I have personally seen his cars, and seen what they can do and I know that he knows his stuff.
Joshua Dearman wrote:^O yeah, your right cause your the alignment man..........
Why change all the parts?
Would you like it if your neighbor knew he had a @!#$-UP car and tried to road it, coming around a corner he lost control and hit you? How about you Mr. alignment tech?
HE KNOWS HE VISUALLY HAS A PROBLEM WITH THE WHEELS TRACKING....if he woulda said...."I woke up this morning and my tires didn't look right...what should I do?" I would say, take it to an alignment shop. When he says he got hit by a 3K+ lbs. object at speed, followed by visually bent tracking you ALREADY KNOW your gonna be swapping parts! Where does it take a genius?
So......now...what parts to change? Obviously the control arm, cars bone of our legs, make sure its ok and just replace it. So your wheel got hit, obviously change that cause its probly out of round. If the wheel has been damaged you gotta go after the brakes and get them new. Next the rack as the knucle obviously got forced in on the backside and probly bent the rod if not stripped the gears in the rack.....I'd change the whole entire rack. The wheel bearing, comes to whatever you want to do, I would, but if you want to save money there's nothing wrong with trying the old one and see if you have any problems.
To the OP, this is the best advise on this thread...DO NOT listen to the "alignment tech"...he wont pay your law suit when your car crashed into something when you knew it wasn't road worthy!
That's 300ish dollars right there for things that MIGHT be wrong. Why not take it to a shop, and find out if anything is wrong at all.
You have way too much time on your hands Joshua. I merely stated my background to establish credentials/experience which is more than you can say. Your posts in this thread are just establishing that you replace components no matter if they are good or bad which makes no sense and helps no one. You are making yourself sound less and less credible to help anyone. You keep bringing up this whole safety issue as if the car was dropped off a cliff. The vehicle was not totaled from OP description of said issue. My god you make yourself sound like this poor guy should junk his car or that it's a menace to society because of a little collision. Nobody is going to die relax!!!!!!! Sounds like your under a little stress or maybe your a severe paranoia, one too many red bulls perhaps. I don't need to get into detail but your comments regarding certain components prove your clueless. There is more to an alignment than just looking at the readings, they point you in the direction of possible issues which at that point whomever is working on the vehicle will look said components over for issues. Vehicles are far more stout than you give them credit for.
Alex good luck with your vehicle it will be back on the road in no time.
ASE Master Certified Automotive Technician
Ok I did not read any of the comments posted above cause, well it's too much to read and I don't care.
Somone hit you and you need to take it to a body shop. Question answeared.
Josh you have given mis information too many times on this site. You think you are somebody, but I think it shows you aren't. My point was inspect the car (which he claims to have done), if things look good (which he claims it does), test drive it. I would start with in the driveway, turning the wheels and trying things out, if that works make it to the road and go slowly. If that is all good take it to the shop have a alignment. If money is not a option tow it to the shop.
FU Tuning
I also agree to have it evaluated at a shop before replacing anything, unless you can physically see something bent (like your tie rod looks like a boomerang). This way you are only buying the parts you need. I also think those prices given are kinda low unless you are junkyarding everything, which I wouldnt recomend for lots of that.
Just call your insurance and ask them to tow it to a shop to have the suspension fixed after the accident.....the bill will go to the person at fault's insurance.
throwing parts at it to get it to drive straight however, would be on your nickel.
i know just the parts wouldent come to 500$ but have you ever had parts installed. a shop will rap you for labor idk if alex has the ability or not just sayin all those parts installed would be atleat 400$. hey in all serousnes were didyou find a control arm for 15.00 im in need of a driver side but havent really stated lookim.
o and im sorry if i offened you by questioning your unending god like automotive knowledge joshua. im not sayin im right by any means just givin my opinion.
Ray, have you heard of insurance? things like this are what it's there for.
Joshua - if you had half of a brain, you might understand what we're saying, but here, I'll try again for you.
take the car to an alignment shop (Josh, you know, one of those places that fixes your car and makes it drive properly) and have them do a full inspection(make sure everything is working proper
) of the steering components, and anything else that may need some additional attention.
that way, you can go
that you didn't have to spend nearly as much money in the long run.
John Higgins wrote:Josh you have given mis information too many times on this site.
??? Please show me what you are talking about.
So far all we are dealing with hear are opinions right? mine vs. a couple others here....how is that mis-information? I've backed-up my opinions with concious facts that could be in play, what do you guys back up with? Your exsperience and lack of seeing similar situations cause serious damage...ok....theres value there I understand. But nobody can come at me and dis-credit anything I've ever done for this site or bring into question my "quality"(if you will) of posts just because you dont like my opinion of what to do....Seriously? Geez....kids please!
Not many people know my backround cause I dont go around taughnting or braggin.....and I wont change that...can't say that about ALOT of people on this site. Nobody wins in a penis contest, we've all seen that too many times. As far as I'm concerned this thread is already more than useless to the OP and by now has read enough crap....he will do what he feels best to do.
I'm serious John, I've gotta call you out on the "mis-information" bit....please show me. You try to put others down to feel better? I dont understand the need, or the factual basis. PLEASE!
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When I sit back and try to see where you guys are comming from I can definetly follow your logic about getting some shop advice...ok. Fair enough, I guess the point I was trying to make(which its obvious I didn't do a good job sending across) is that by the time you pay the shop for whatever labor they will hit you with...even if just for the alignment you could have changed half of the parts already. More-to-the-point is I think the OP will be behind overall if he starts at a shop instead of just trying to identify the issue and fix the problem himself first. -kinda plays in-line with very first line I wrote in this thread....
I'm really trying to move on...but...on the last note here, if I do change more parts than the average bear...so be it....whos it hurting? I just dont understand how my credibility can come into play and my quality of information can be discredited just because I turn "unnecessary" bolts. Seriously.....who gives a @!#$? How can you say I dont know what I'm talking about? OR "knock me down a notch" because you think....."I think I'm somebody"....give me a @!#$ing break....REALLY? -Did you really mean that? Please tell me that was all a joke......1977.....c'mon man...act your age.
Benham has a point....wheres your insurance sit on this one?
Edited 3 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, December 16, 2008 11:05 PM
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Quote:
by the time you pay the shop for whatever labor they will hit you with...even if just for the alignment you could have changed half of the parts already
This is not true. I think what myself a few others meant. If you go to get a alignment and there is something bent, broke etc... they can't do the alignment. Most shops inspect for free nowadays. This saves money, instead of throwing parts at something.
As for my other comment, I'm not going to go back and find the examples, I was referring to other post. You should remember them because they were alot like this post.
FU Tuning
