Im just debating on weather too put a rear tie bar on this dirt track car or just welding a bar?
What are some of the advantages of having a rear tie bar when already having a rear eibach
sway bar? If I did weld a bar across would this act as the same as a rear tie bar or does it
need some give? And one more question what setup do you have Phil lindsays or MIsinblu?
thanks schmitzracing
MIsinblu's design is a lot simpler, and more effective IMO, as well as costing less.
Depending on your driving.....it can be well worth it, or just the opposite, and actually hurt you some.
I would assume that welding a bar would be very similar, but you lack adjustability in it then.
u say it can hurt me some how? Maybe ill try the sway bar for now and see if i like that. thanks
ill let everybody if its worth just for knowledge in the future!
It is worth it...depending on the type of driving you are trying to accomplish.
If you read some of the rear tie bar thread's in this forum, it goes into more details about when it will be to your advantage, and when it is not.
I went with misinblus parts list alitlle cheaper then the other one. I just got it all bolted on.
Mainly what im trying too do is get the car too not push so much in the corner the more
oversteer the better. These dirt track cars push alot. I might try moving the passenger
side rear end back an inch and try moving the cradle driver side back a inch. thanks
The tiebar does nothing more than keep the trailing arms parallel under hard cornering.
Without it, such as in racing, the trailing arms can deflect which can cause toe issues that can cause ill handling effects which you do not want.
Also, you can adjust the tie bar to either push the trailing arms out, creating more toe in or you can have them pull in, creating more toe out.
There are advantages with toe in and toe out so do some reading on suspension dynamics to understand which is best for your type of driving.
Either way, I would suggest that you do have tension on the tie bar whether it's pushing or pulling the trailing arms. It's that tension that keeps it all solid without any deflection of the arms.
If you were to use or weld on a bar to the trailing arms, you'd lose all independance of the rear of which there is very little but still, it would make it more solid that it is.
This would cause more issues than results so stick with something that will last and help you out without affecting the suspension travel.
Good luck with it.
Oh and pictures would be nice of your setup.
I'm curious to see what you're doing.
Also, consider some chassis bracing if you've not done so already. I'm guessing you've got a roll cage with this car but not sure.
Pics ftw.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO! 
Hey Blu what's up, my aluminum control arms came out great and I couldn't be happier, how much to make me a rear tiebar for my 2000 Z24? I have the Tien SS coilovers, Addco 26mm rear swaybar and Neon rear discs, do you need any other info from me in order to make the tie bar for me?
Well, I'm glad you're happy and you do know that you'll have to post up some pics when you get the control arms installed.
On the tiebar, the parts list is universal for all 3rd gen J-bodies. It really makes no difference in what you have under the axle because it doesn't get in the way of anything.
Instead of getting the 44 inch bar, you may want to get the 43 or if they don't make that size, 42 inch bar.
But personally, I like the 44 inch bar because you can custom tailor it for a perfect fit to the length. It's easy to cut with a simple hacksaw and a quick swoop of a file to bevel the edge, and you're done.
Here's the page for how to do it.
Contact me if you have any questions.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
Is it hitting your exhaust pipe? Why is the tie bar in 2 pieces? I fear that it will eventually snap the middle bolt with too much articulation or if it gets too corroded.
What the EFF kind of sway bar is that?!?!?!? And what is it bolted to on either end?!?!? Perhaps that's part of the mystery banging?
14.330 @ 96.37mph
its banging on the exhaust pipe. mine does it and its about an inch lower then yours.
That tiebar is useless.
You've basically boxed in your trailing arms making it solid as a rock. Bang go the bushings or what's going to be left of them.
So now your trailing arm bushings are going to take a beating with that tiebar because the tiebar needs to have spherical ends so that the trailing arms can have some independance of movement.
Also, the mounting points of the D bushing on the axle is pretty much useless as well. As a matter of fact, you might as well just eliminate the swaybar you've got on the car and just leave the tiebar on it.
From an engineering point of view, what you have is useless and pointless in concept.
What basically ruins it all is that tiebar.
Because it's rigidly mounted to the end of the arms, it defeats the purpose of the swaybar, and lessens the twisting motion of the rear arms which is what you'd have to have for the swaybar to work.
So now when you're going around a corner, all the twisting action is going to be absorbed by your rear axle bushings which mounts the rear arms to the chassis.
I do like the subframe brace and kudo's for that design. Very nice and I bet it's rigid as it can get. Nice.
I also see that you made and designed that swaybar yourself and the tiebar. Kudo's for good thinking.
My apologies if I've dissed your ideas but their functionality is mute and will make your car handle worse than before.
I'm trying to help and not hurt here.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
^^^that was the nicest pwnage.....i think i have ever seen....
John Benham wrote:^^^that was the nicest pwnage.....i think i have ever seen....
I actually like the work that was done. It's nice and refreshing to see someone go the route that 'blackout did.
Great thinking and would like to hear some feedback from 'blackout on this.
A review would be nice too.
But I still stick with my post on the flaws of the designs although the excecution is superb.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
I agree 100% there are flaws in some of the design work with it.
I would not give excecution a "superb" either, but thats my opinion.
I think I like the subfram brace the best out of everything.
That sway bar is made by Progress technology and its 22mm....its a really nice bar.
John trust me the Blu's pwnage in real life is so much better.
Joshua Dearman wrote:That sway bar is made by Progress technology and its 22mm....its a really nice bar.
yeah that is a progress 22mm sway bar.
and i have since taken the tie bar off. it was hitting my exhaust. me and a buddy of mine just threw that together very quickly after we put on my lowering springs. we will be making another one with better connections at the ends
M62 KIT for sale PM ME
Probably better that way. I think you would be happy with a properly designed tie bar.
Look up the other rear tie bar thread in here, there are pictures of Misnblu's setup, that is the simplest, most effective design I have seen on the org.
yeah i have been looking at his, definately a sweet set up. mine was just something thrown together with scrap pieces laying around the shop. more so outta boredom
M62 KIT for sale PM ME
Well with the way blu's car is set up it is completely nuetral. This bar will really settle the rear which will even help on drag launches and the such.
total blackout wrote:Joshua Dearman wrote:That sway bar is made by Progress technology and its 22mm....its a really nice bar.
yeah that is a progress 22mm sway bar.
and i have since taken the tie bar off. it was hitting my exhaust. me and a buddy of mine just threw that together very quickly after we put on my lowering springs. we will be making another one with better connections at the ends
That's the first time I've ever seen the Progress bar.
I see that the ends are fastened to the strut bolts making it a solid mount with no bushings on the endlinks. That's a nice design on the part of Progress.
It just seems strange to see the D bushings attached to the axle like it is though. I've never seen that before and again, this is why I was thinking that it was home made.
With the solid ends of the swaybar, you should have a pretty stiff bar being 22mm in size.
A review of it would be nice, especially if this is your first rear bar you've installed.
And again, I give you kudo's for being bored and thinking up of the tiebar idea while especially liking the subframe brace design. Nice.
That's talent man and good thinking.
Good luck on the tiebar though. It's easy to put together, looks good, and is completely functional.
Keep us posted on this.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
I have the progress bar and I've driven both addco and progress on the same car and I think the progress gives a more crisp feeling entering the turns and a faster bounce back when exiting with a little more oversteer at those key points but giving a stuck to the ground feeling during the turn than the addco bar gives. The addco feels like oversteer is common throughout the entire turn instead of giving a bite like the progress does when the weight transitions are finished. (I hope that makes since....)
Of cource thats with a 1" addco in the front....must clarify that and was in place when both bars were used. I had no tie bar but do have the FE3 package which gave the chepo sway bar inside the axle so maybe the 1" rear addco in tandem just made it overkill and asked for oversteer.
EDIT: I started with the progress and moved up to the addco and went back to the progress.....if anybody is wondering.
I wouldn't say the progress is better, but for my setup it is. Again, largely dependent on suspension tuning and front sway ect. ect.
EDIT AGAIN: Trying to give a better example.....with the addco, once oversteer was well established and the back was in a slight slide it would continue until the turn was completed. With the progress it will still give the same oversteer entering and exiting a turn but will actually mellow out and re-gain rear traction once the weight transition is completed and the turn is fully initiated or completed. I hope that helps.
This was with Yokohama AVS100(decent to high end street tire) 225's all around and TEIN SS coilovers on both setups.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, August 12, 2008 11:30 PM
