What are those prices going to look like?

I'm looking for the coils and adapter plate...



Knowledge about everything and yet an expert of nothing!!
Jack of all trades.

now this coil conversion switches over to coils and wires, correct?? i have a few questions about this conversion.... what are the benefits on a boosted car vs. the stock ignition system???? also, is this conversion compatible with the msd dis 2 6212 and HPT???? what plugs would be best for this setup??? if someone wants to send me what they know, maybe i can come up with some plug and play harnesses and brackets to make peoples lives a bit easier, IM me on aim and i will see what i can do. btw my aim is cavghst


many changes in the making
my favorite part about doing bodywork,.......... bondo bugers

You could also sacrifice 4K PEAK volts and save about 70 bucks and use the mitsu coil pack instead and not even need to change the ICM.

RaGiN Z (the fake 05) wrote:You could also sacrifice 4K PEAK volts and save about 70 bucks and use the mitsu coil pack instead and not even need to change the ICM.

How does that work? Are they direct swaps for the coil over plugs in the 2.4? What Mitsu model are these parts from?

Also you do not need to swap the ICM if you do the full MSD swap (coils & adapter plate). Only reason you need to do the ICM swap most people are doing is because it is cheaper than doing the MSD swap. From what I have read the ICMs are identical between the 2.2 and the 2.4... It's just the connections (plugs), location, and coil setup that are different.

I went to a local wrecker and they wanted $75 for the ICM and coils (no wiring included)... By the time I get the wiring and get the 2.2 ICM wired in it's not worth my time. I'd rather use the 2.4 ICM w/the MSD adapter and coils.



Knowledge about everything and yet an expert of nothing!!
Jack of all trades.

There are three wires that go into the 2.4 coil packs, the positive, and the two grounds, one for each coil (positive is shared between the two). Same hookup for the mits 420A coil pack. Except its all in one and you don't need the adapter. All you need is the wiring harness connector (free from any pick and pull)

8.5mm MSD wires for the 2.2 and you are set. I swear, if you use anything less then what's the point! I used MSD coil packs because I couldn't get a straight answer from Accel about specs and for everything else the resistance was higher than MSD. Resistance is the devil! The MSD also has a higher turn ratio as well.

Is there a part list for this mod?? phil

I wish I had more time on my hands..... maybe after the bash and all.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, July 24, 2007 8:59 AM

SPD RCR Z - '02 Z24 420whp
SLO GOAT - '04 GTO 305whp
W41 BOI - '78 Buick Opel Isuzu W41 Swap

I need to know what all it would take to do this on my eco.Actually just what box to run and how to set it up,,anyhelp?

RaGin mentioned how the MSD's have a lower resistance over the stock DIS twin-tower coils, and this is true. I've done a bench test of their resistance and found MSD's primary notably lower. However, with the stock ICM this only means the current level sensing-limiting circuitry will only find the primary circuit load building more quickly before restraining itself to a limit of 1-amp before the circuit break is triggered. This "Quick-rise" design is very desirable in high RPM or multi-strike ignition apps. Still, the real question is what the secondary KV is, and what good does it do? Well in deals like my truck with it's 2.2 OHV, where the stock gap is .060", this means a smoother idle over the stock coils, which are 13-yrs old w/ 190,000mi. on them. (Just thought I'd meantion that detail.) I have been considering doing the coil/ICM relocation on it since learning of how in the later years of the LN2 it was placed at the trailing end of the head. Of course, this application of mine won't allow room for it there, so on a raised bracket atop the head should suffice the same. The only real problem is the crank trigger runs to the ICM, not the ECM, so my harness is different than most here will see. At least the 12v Pos & Neg can be just rerouted since they're on a separate loom. Anyone think they can make on for me, or am I on my own here?

Go beyond the "bolt-on".

Don't forget to use the MSD 8.5mm wires as well. If you turn around and use stock wires u might as well just relocate the stock coils, if you ask me.

Also you are completely right about the stock ICM, but that's why you get the DIS 2 box, especially the digital box (which has the ability to destroy stock coil packs), they spike the voltage going into the coil pack with in of itself is just a step up transformer. The car runs smoother, has a brighter cleaner spark, which leads to better gas mileage, better combustion, longer engine life, helps with knock and detonation and is pretty much a must for high boost and/or nitrous applications.

How much of a difference, between an msd setup and our stock coil packs are there? Damned if I know, that's something that someone like protomec needs to answer.

This is the diagram I have of the internal wiring of the 2.2OHV setup.
This is one of the two.
If you look at the bottom of the picture, you'll see the three prong plug that comes out of the stock 2.4 ICM.
It's the two white and one black wire that triggers the 1/4 and 2/3 DIS coils.
If you look carefully, you'll see which wire according to the color code of the plug wires trigger what coil pack.


Here you'll see the factory 2.4 ICM turned around 180 degrees on it's untouched or unmodified factory harness coming from the PCM.
It's flexible enough to be able to turn it around the 180 degrees needed so that the 3prong plug that fires the 1/4 and 2/3 coils have better access to get to the coils.
You'll also see that 3 prong plug in the picture facing the camera.
I also added the CPU heatsink to dissipate excess heat from the ICM.
Remember, the only thing done here is that the ICM was removed off of the IDI cover, turned around 180 degrees, and then wired into the external DIS packs.


Here you'll see the to the right of the heat sink the clip for the 3 prong plug and on the left is the factory PCM plug going into the ICM. The ICM is under the heatsink.

This is something that anyone can do with parts from their car.
All they have to do is extend the wires from their 3 prong plug (the two white and one black 1/4-2/3 output connector) and have them go to the MSD coil housing adaptors.
It's easy to determine what wire fires what coil by the picture above.
Nothing else has to be cut or purchased with the exception of the MSD items.
I did hit the junkyard and got another one of the 3 prong plugs, converted it for the external DIS mod, and kept everything under the IDI cover untouched so that if I needed to, could reconvert it back to the IDI setup in a matter of minutes.

Last, having the external setup makes it that much easier to tie into your MSD DIS2 setup.
Very easy to do and makes a world of difference.

Hope this helped somebody out.
Btw, I've had this setup for several years and have had not one problem from the conversion.






Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!

Thats the exact same setup I'm running on both the T/G Drag car and my '02. All the info I got on how to do it, came from that man there ^^^ (exact pics and all)

All we did (Team GREEN, mainly Tom/Wrenchmonkey) was take it that next step, and use the MSD coil adapters, and offered it as a full plug and play setup for those who didn't want to do the work.





SPD RCR Z - '02 Z24 420whp
SLO GOAT - '04 GTO 305whp
W41 BOI - '78 Buick Opel Isuzu W41 Swap

^^^

myself and others are more then happy he stepped up and did it

Considering that when I first introduced this mod to the JBO a few years back, it was denounced, ridiculed, and literally laughed at.
I'm more than happy though that someone else stood up to the plate, tried it, and found it to be a viable approach to a better ignition setup than factory.
Thank you Brian.

We all contribute in our own ways which is why I remain on the JBO forums.
It's a wealth of information and to this day, continue to learn so that when that day comes, all of this information will give me the Cavalier that I still am dreaming of. It will come.

Back on topic.


Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!

We all contribute in our own ways which is why I remain on the JBO forums.
It's a wealth of information and to this day, continue to learn so that when that day comes, all of this information will give me the Cavalier that I still am dreaming of. It will come.Back on topic.

quoted for TRUTH ... !!


im on my 4th cavalier and im still dremaing of it! looks like ill be doing the 2.2 coil swap

I did mine the exact same way Blu did his but I used the IDI cover harness and ran that into my DIS-II and ran the coil drivers from the MSD into the harness for the 2.2 ICM. From there I modified the inside like Blu did by soldering leads to tie the circuit together inside the 2.2 ICM(hollowed out case) which allows the ability to just throw on coils using the factory 2.2 setup....Very nice, I've been running mine like that for about a year now and it is awesome. Data logs show a significant reduction in knock at mid-high RPM.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:19 PM

Does anyone have links to the msd parts?

And do u have to re wire stuff that's where I'm really lost. I'm lookin at misnblu's mini write up and the first pic is re-wiring something.. is there a way of doing this without re-wiring anything? Misnblu's second and third pic look straight forward its the first part/pic that threw me off.

well lets see.......

No, you dont have to..... but your car isnt going to run.

I dont have links for the parts either..... sorry.




SPD RCR Z - '02 Z24 420whp
SLO GOAT - '04 GTO 305whp
W41 BOI - '78 Buick Opel Isuzu W41 Swap

lol!

I take that back, I might have part numbers...... will have to check the garage.

As far as wiring, the pic from MisnBlu is how to use the 2.2/2200 coil.... on the first page, Tom posted a pic of how to wire the MSD parts.




SPD RCR Z - '02 Z24 420whp
SLO GOAT - '04 GTO 305whp
W41 BOI - '78 Buick Opel Isuzu W41 Swap

So all in all. Juss gotta splice the three wires from the stock 2.4 to the msd coils? And your good to go?

ben aaron wrote:So all in all. Juss gotta splice the three wires from the stock 2.4 to the msd coils? And your good to go?

Pretty much yes. It's no different than what I did but you're buying the parts to make it work as opposed to gutting the 2.2 ICM and rewiring it so that the factory plugs can be used to make it a seamless installation that looks factory.
I just redid a friends 2.2 setup in which I'll be posting up the newest schematics of what was done and how it can be done if that's what people want to do with their own setups.
Either way it's a worthwhile mod.
Good luck.



Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!

Good deal. I,juss gotta find out what msd part I need.

yes.... the 3 wires under the idi cover (coming out of the ign. control mod)

I found a couple packages from the msd coil blocks..... I forgot to bring it in so I could post the number.




SPD RCR Z - '02 Z24 420whp
SLO GOAT - '04 GTO 305whp
W41 BOI - '78 Buick Opel Isuzu W41 Swap

Any part number for the msd coils?