Well, I will be swapping a 2.3HO in my sunfire next spring. While I searched and found ALOT of good information about this swap I still have some concerns. My car is a daily driver so I want to know what I'm getting into well before I start.
What I'm asking for is Detailed instructions on:
What is needed(ie, computer wiring ect.),
Anything that will need to be custom built,
Problems one may encounter,
tips,
ect..
I'm hoping we can get all of the information on this topic into this ONE post and make it a sticky. I know there is a few of you out there who know alot about this! so I'm asking for your wisdom to help me, and all the others who are looking into doing this swap.
Thank you in advance,
Chris
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Anybody?
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wow..im the first to post? hehe
well first off..since you have manual 2.4 J its going to be easier for you than for others..FIRST you need the motor ofcourse..and since you have a 2.4 already you CAN use your stock tranny (the one with the HO engine from 92-94 would be an upgrade though) when you get the motor you will need all the power steering components that came with it..youll be converting to a belt drive power steering(no big deal) works just as good.
you will also need the pcm from a 1995 Z or GT manual quad equipped Jbody and all the engine bay wiring that came with it.
all of your engine mounts are gonna be the same so dont worry about that..your gonna wanna use your stock alternator(which bolts up the same) and the HO chip from mantapart to put in your pcm would be ideal as well
it really isnt much trouble at all..just remember..you want both intake and exhaust manifolds that come with the engine BUT the exhaust manifold is NOT going to bolt up to your stock downpipe so youll need a new downpipe welded up...
did i miss anything? where you at gilles?
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My car is a daily driver so I want to know what I'm getting into well before I start.
guess i should mentioned youll really want to wire up the fan mode switch cus if your stuck in daily traffic (like i am) youll want to keep it running alot to keep your HO cool...and if you have the time and cash i suggest changing the headgasket BEFORE you install it ( unless its already been changed) ...hmmmmm what else......
If you want to avoid wiring totaly, try HP Tuners. Seeing how your car is a 97, and I belive HPT works on 97 and up the PCM shouldn't have to be swapped. Would give you pretty much total control of everything needed to run the HO motor properly. Other than that I would suggest a 92+ block as the oil pan will have the oil level sender and the upper motor mount will have the correct size holes. Older blocks have smaller holes. Depending on what cylinder head the motor has depends on what exhaust manifold and downpipe you have to run. If its an 086 (the good one) run the exhaust manifold that came with that motor and have a down pipe made up. If its a 756 head, still use the manifold that came with the motor, but it MIGHT be possible to use the down pipe off your car, or possibly one off a 95 z24. Otherwise have one made up, thats what I did.
13.934 @ 97.82
ALL MOTOR
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a 92+ block as the oil pan will have the oil level sender and the upper motor mount will have the correct size holes.
on that note you should probably know that youll need a pre 92 engine to get the 086 head(the best one)
and im not really sure whats up with the upper mount i first used the 95 mount..then when i broke it(dont ask) i used one off a 2.4
The 086 was available in 92. Also, even if you have a 955, 753 head, you can use the 90-92 Ho exhaust manifold.
Gilles
2.3 Ho
iirc the cam sensor can be turned off in HPT (itll run in batch which the HO did anyway). thats the biggest hurdle in the swap really. id use a new venture trans too but thats not mandatory. with HPT its more or less a bolt in afair
block 92+
head 086 (89-92 i think)
92+ nvg-t550 trans
plenty of info on here to search for..
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
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block 92+
ya know..since the only advantage the 92+ had was the oil level sensor wouldnt it make more sense to just get the pre 92 engine ( since youll get the 086 head with it ) and just change the oil pan? seems like it would be easier to just change a pan than for some people to swap heads and blocks...just my 02
mounts.. also this would give you a chance to put on a fresh head gasket..
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
you have a good point with the headgasket...but mounts?
Cavfan1 wrote:Other than that I would suggest a 92+ block as the oil pan will have the oil level sender and the upper motor mount will have the correct size holes. Older blocks have smaller holes.
only if you mind tapping is it a huge issue I suppose..
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
now see thats what im confused about ...i had a 90 engine and i had NO issues with mounts.. i didnt have to tap anything...then later when i broke it i used a 98 2.4 upper mount and it worked just as good..maybe i just got lucky
they are all be the same, I got an 88 motor and a 93 motor and the holes are all the same. Same location, same thread, different mounts.
Also, the 93 oil level...here's the thing. The 95 oil level connector, it plugs right into the 93 sensor and works. getting it back out is the tricky part. you need a small screwdriver and some patience if you have to remove the oil pan or sensor. LOL
Going to revive this post for a bit here. I bought my HO a few months ago, currently sitting in my basement apart. waiting on gaskets to put it backtogether, or if i want to attempt the Stroker which ive been thinking about for a few months.
Now, what im still not sure about, is the PCM and wiring. i took the PCM and all the wiring out of the beretta, and im thinking of just swapping all that in. Now as stated above, i can use the PCM from a 95 J body but i still need all the wiring... seems pointless if I have the beretta PCM. So im wondering which is easier? My guess was just use all the HO wires and PCM.
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I dont think either would be bad on the engine...but which pcm is going to work better with the rest of the car? like the cluster..you get that from the beretta too?
no, thats what I was unsure about, the PCM will obviously work with the engine, but the cluster was my main concern.
So basicly, the 95 PCM will work with the HO, and the sunfire cluster will work normally aswell?? whereas, the beretta PCM won't work with the 97 cluster? is this right?
Also, does the 95 PCM need to be chipped to acount for the higher redline of the HO?
thanks again.
-Chris
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the 95 pcm will work with the cluster fine..infact it would probably be your best choice as to not have issues..as for the chip the stock pcm will run the ho fine...add the chip to run it better!..still available thru mantapart..or with alittle skill i think they make the tools to burn your own now
hmm really... ok its all getting clearer... I thought the 95's had a rev limiter at like 6500RPM or somthing like that?
well off to find a 95 PCM haha...
Hows the Stroker comming along? waiting for parts still?
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thats what i did, i swapped to a 95 ecm, its not that hard. just get both diagram from both ecm and rewire the 95 plugs.
But i think it would be easier to just use HPT...???
now if you go with the 95 ecu, i have the HO mantapart chip and i will be getting the tools soon (beginning of summer) to burn my own chip and tune in real time, so i could sell you my mantapart one for alot less than what manta is selling it for. (they sell it for 200+US)
or if you get the tools to burn and tune, i can just send you the .bin file from the chip so you could have something to start with.
hmm that would be nice... yea i was comparing the PCM wiring diagrams a while ago and wasnt sure all that needed to be spliced and redone. Im good with wiring and reading wiring diagrams so that shouldnt be too too bad. As far as the chip goes, keep me posted. as I said im waiting to get some money to get gaskets for the damn engine because everywhere wants so much. Hopeing to have it in the car running by june.
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CHEAP GM OEM gasket set for ya:
gasket
thats a chance i was looking on ebay yerterday and found this....
there is the exhaust you need if you dont already have it:
ebay link
also for your exhaust mani, maybe Scott will have his engine running soon and have time to get a custom header made for us before you put that engine in, hint...hint...
ohhhhhh stop STOP! haha, that idea is definitely sounding good!...
Thanks for the link! put my bid in haha.
as for the 2nd link. My motor is from a 90 GTZ so i have the good manifold. Thanks tho
Im pupmed to get this motor in! should make a nice lil difference over my twincam...
-Chris
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are you upgrading the internal?
